lysdexic

joined 2 years ago
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[–] lysdexic@programming.dev -3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The problem isn’t a principle of a computer science, but one of just safety.

I think you missed the point entirely.

You can focus all you want in artificial Ivory tower scenarios, such as a hypothetical ability to rewrite everything from scratch with the latest and greatest tech stacks. Back in the real world, that is a practical impossibility in virtually all scenarios, and a renowned project killer.

In addition, the point stressed in the article is that you can add memory safety features even to C programs.

Also, who said this is a principle of computer science?

Anyone who devotes any resource learning software engineering.

Here's a somewhat popular essay in the subject:

https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/04/06/things-you-should-never-do-part-i/

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

I never used this app but it looks like it just does what nvm already does. What exactly makes n more elegant than nvm?

From what I'm seeing, n drops the ball on Windows support, which nvm handles well.

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

C++ can be written to be safe. I don’t think WH is the right authority to issue this warning. Naming C++ rather than going after specific features is unfair.

I suspect that the white house just received a report from some people in the industry stating that faulty software is vulnerable to attacks from bad actors, and from that basis they just went the simplistic path of arguing that 1) lots of software is written in C++, 2) that software has bugs, therefore if we don't use C++ then we won't have bugs.

As a branch of government, their role is not to evaluate technical merits of proposals but to hear what their representatives have to say.

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 0 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Honestly his defence is rather weak. “It’s been improving and there are ways to use it safely.”

I think it's a very good and clear point to make.

Some programming languages are blindly deemed "safe" in spite of supporting unsafe memory management strategies, and somehow not enforcing those rules does not render them unsafe.

Why is this logic not applied to C++?

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The time for the c++ committee to show they can overcome the language’s issues has passed IMHO there are much better, and more expressive, alternatives.

I'm not sure if this is a good take.

Languages deemed "safe" boil down to two features: supporting specific memory management strategies, and adding static code analysis checks that enforce rules and best practices.

Can't this be done already without involving committees?

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev -5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Even following the guidelines, modern C++ is just a huge pile of half-finished ideas.

You're making it pretty clear that you are completely oblivious to what C++ is, what are the differences between C++ versions, and what are the real world issues solved by each new version.

I would ask you to clarify your persona clams by providing a concrete example to back each of your statements, but I know you have none.

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 1 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Well ok, but the concern is about the weaknesses, Mr. Stroustrup.

I don't think these discussions on "weaknesses" come from a place of intelectual honesty. None of these arguments even touches the fact that there are already a myriad of freely available static code analysis tools and memory profilers that do a very good job catching memory safety issues.

For some unexplainable reason, these criticisms of C++ always focus on a single strawman: these tools do not exist and no developer in the world cares about the topic.

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 8 points 1 year ago

So how fucked am I for starting to learn cpp as my first language, or is this a later down the road thing to worry about?

I don't see why you should be concerned, except that no professional software developer is limited to use one specific programming language.

Even if you pay attention to the disaster prophets in the crowd, which are mainly comprised of fanboys implicitly and explicitly promoting their pet language/frameworks, C++ dominates all aspects of the computing ecosystem, which means that in the very least the whole world needs to maintain existing C++ projects to continue to work. See COBOL for reference.

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev -3 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Such a braindead exercise to see Redis follow suit

I agree, this sounds like a desperate cash grab.

I mean, cloud providers who are already using Redis will continue to do so without paying anything at all, as they're using stable versions of a software project already released under a permissive license. That ship has sailed.

Major cloud providers can certainly afford developing their own services. If Amazon can afford S3 and DynamoDB, they can certainly develop from the ground up their own Redis-like memory cache. In fact, Microsoft already announced Garnet, which apparently outperforms Redis in no small way.

So who exactly is expected to pay for this?

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev 16 points 1 year ago (12 children)

${CORPORATION} has profited off of Redis without giving much back (...)

I don't understand this blend of comment.

If you purposely release your work as something anyone in the world is free to use and change to adapt to their own personal needs without any expectation of retribution or compensation, why are you complaining that people are using your work without any retribution or compensation?

More to the point, why are you singling out specific adopters while leaving out the bulk of your community?

It makes absolutely no sense at all.

[–] lysdexic@programming.dev -2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This sounds like it would be hotly disputed by almost anyone you said it out loud to, even if you said it 40 years ago.

I think you're expressing uninformed and uneducated opinions.

Even Debian's computer language benchmarks game showcases C consistently outperforming Rust, with some notable exceptions in some key benchmarks.

And Rust was not a thing 40 years ago.

Anyway, I think I proved my point with regards to the silly idea that performance is a decisive trait. You cannot have your cake and eat it, too.

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