A lot of wallets are also badly designed because they lack a means to secure coins. Look for a wallet that has a zipper compartment on the side and you’ll be less annoyed with coins.
freedomPusher
joined 4 years ago
MODERATOR OF
Just you wait for AI powered laundromats.
Can’t wait for that.. “you paid with an American credit card but the last time you used the laundromat you did not use the tumble dryer which is not American-like. And these are not American clothes; we detect as many scarves as a European would have, and those low crotch pants look Nepalese or African. Please contact our fraud office if you think we have made an error.”
(edit) …15 min later…
“We see that you removed the scarves and low-crotch pants from your load and that you attempted to order tumble dry service in advance. This conformist behavior is inconsistent with your KYC profile. We have therefore suspended your account for your security until you conduct a 30 minute interview with our automated KYC specialists.”
(edit) …2 min later…
“You have just been instantly validated based on personality traits due to the article you just deposited into the washing machine. Unfortunately we do not yet have a cleaning program in the database for human excrement. Please subscribe to our newsletter so you can monitor new developments and new cleaning programs.”
Your CC got blocked, call your bank and solve it.
The account was in good standing worked daily, before and after the laundry attempt. When an online merchant blocks me my bank often tells me “it’s not coming from us; your account is fine on our side”.
I was never given the answer. How can you solve a problem when merchants will not tell you what the problem is? They think they are dealing with fraud so they are afraid to inform (who they regard as) a criminal. Getting information out of a merchant about a failed transaction is a social engineering effort on par with what hackers do.
It’s legal to reject foreign cards
One thing I’ve noticed is that some merchants refuse cards on the basis of being foreign issued. It may have been what my issue was with the laundromat, but I can only guess. Rejecting a card on the basis of being foreign violates the merchant agreement with visa and mastercard, but it is not law and merchants often violate the merchant agreement because Visa and MC do not enforce the contract. I have in fact reported instances of merchants violating the merchant agreement and the credit card networks ignore these complaints.
When everyone else goes to the laundry and doesn’t have the right coins they should do exactly what? Take a trip downtown to the bank?
You can, and it would be a good exercise for you to see first hand how banks treat consumers when they tell you GTFO for asking for a small amount of coins. You will see for yourself that banks are unworthy of the power you give them.
Your local cigarettes shop isn’t obligated to break you a 20.
Fuck that shop then. They don’t want your business and have failed to earn it. It’s a worthy exercise just to know where you stand.
I barely use cash and my payments always work. … What am I doing wrong that digital payments always work for me?
You’re living a boxed in life just the way they want you to.
how to live a conventional boxed-in life
You’re not traveling internationally and using a foreign cards, you’re not using Tor, you’re not blocking untrustworthy JavaScript, you solve every CAPTCHA, you’re happy to subscribe to mobile phone service and to share that phone number willy nilly with anyone who asks, you’re willing to transact with Google to install whatever closed-source apps banks and merchants want you to, you’re giving merchants and banks a permanent email address (as opposed to using an @spamgourmet.com address), you’re diligently keeping track of your ID expiry and automatically running the new card over to the bank as soon as you get a new ID card to make sure in advance the bank always has a current copy, you never move without telling the bank your new address which would cause the bank’s annual postal check on your address to fail, you’re not American (which triggers extra poor treatment by banks), you never tried to pay a recipient who the bank politically objects to (Wikileaks), you do not buy cryptocurrency, and you must be using Paypal exactly the way Paypal expects (which means no purchases in certain categories and using the account just often enough to not look suspicious but not so often that you trigger one of their countless fraud false flags). If you’ve failed any of that criteria, you’ve merely been strangely lucky.
Much less frequently I cannot pay for digital reasons than for “oh fk, I forgot to withdraw cash again”. I remember that being a weekly problem.
So the one variable that is easily in your own control and you manage to fuck it up. You got issues. But certainly whatever puts you in a situation where an ATM is far from where you need one, you can fairly blame that on the banks who are the proactive cause for ATM sparsity.
Bill Gates and the https://betterthancash.org alliance loves you.
I used to be that way. Used a card to pay for everything; even just a candybar. Then I noticed the banks abusing their power, rampant data breaches because banks and credit bureaus don’t give a shit about data protection, large banks financing private prisons and fossil fuels, small banks investing with large banks, banks abusing KYC to collect far more than legally required, banks taking extortionate fees from merchants, banks nannying consumers by blocking wikileaks, banks forcing people to contract with Google to get their app then forcing people to upgrade their phone hardware (creating more e-waste), etc.
At one point I came to realise I’ve recklessly made myself part of those problems by using banks more than necessary. Banks need a shorter leash and consumers should be holding that leash.
Those engineers took simple design to the fullest extent. But then the landlord dropped the ball or cheaped out by not offering a change machine which could easily be fed when emptying the other machines.
I must say I like the side-effect. It pressures people to use cash in shops. This is a good thing because the #warOnCash is going the way Bill Gates wants it to, which gives more power to the banks and corporations at the expense of disempowering the people. The funny thing about your interaction with the bank is that it serves as yet another instance of banks not using their position ethically. Banks love the war on cash, so making it hard to withdraw or deposit serves as more proof that giving banks exclusive control is a bad idea.
Have you tried this hack? → Buy groceries and intentionally overpay with your card and ask for the difference as cash back in the form of as many as 50¢ coins as the cashier is willing to give?
It is very inclusive
Not in the slightest. Here’s what’s inclusive: cash. Cash does not discriminate against anyone. Banks are a shit show. It was hard to get a Danish account open and funded, and then once it was funded the money was trapped - could not be transferred out internationally.
backup solutions for people who want to top up in cash
They told me to pound sand. And they could not tell me why my bank card was refused despite the account being in good standing.
solutions for when the internet is down.
How so? There is no full-time on-site custodian who can override anything. There is no way to insert cash. The system is outsourced and the apartment managers only work during business hours. Once they had me locked into a lease agreement, they had no motivation to accommodate. Imagine if they did have to dispatch someone to run the machine for me, and then add it to my bill if the system allows it. The human effort every time I need to wash clothes would have made them quickly realise the foolishness of this system.
There is no culture of inclusion with Danish businesses. There are cashless retailers on university campuses. If you want a sandwich at 2pm and you only have cash, you’re stuffed. If you don’t have Facebook, you are excluded from some university announcements. If you do not have a mobile phone service to do the required 2FA for some university resources, they tell you to pound sand. Then if you cheat and use a free pinger number, they take action against you. You cannot even make a photocopy in some places without a CPR number. Denmark is a society that pushes digital exclusion to the greatest extent I have ever experienced.
It’s not a fear problem. It’s an engineering competency problem. They designed something more poorly engineered than the technology it replaced, so it never should have been rolled out. It’s a shitshow of failures and it excludes people, by design. Everyone should be able to clean their clothes, not just a select group who have the right combination of hardware, software, banking service, and unhealthy disregard for privacy and infosec.
Having dirty clothes because your bank card with matching logo was mysteriously refused for unspecified reasons and having to walk 1km to find a machine that works is a far cry from improving quality of life. Compare that to the quality of life someone feels is hindered when they have to carry coins from their apartment to the laundry room.
Lucky people in the included group should also be wise to realise there are excluded people and refuse to use it on that ethical basis.
Fear it when jerks abuse it to gain power
Misappropriation of power is inherently central to this design. Cash gives you freedom. Electronic payments give banks power over you. And they abuse it, like when they blocked donations to Wikileaks. They abuse it when they block you from using Tor. They abuse it when they lock your account because a document on file expired. Or when they require you to form an info-sharing relationship with Google and agree to Google’s terms just to download an app exclusively distributed by Google. It’s important to always have a bank-free option.
It really seems to showcase that schools have lost some competency with engineering. It’s a fundamental failure of basic principles when an engineer introduces a fuck ton of factors that can go wrong in place of something simple that just works. It’s an embarrassment to the engineering discipline.
German engineering used to be held in high regard¹.
It’s like the irrational drive to make everything as electronic as possible is somehow causing engineers to miss the KISS² principle.
Consider why cars do not add a supplemental steam engine.
Superficially, you see how much heat energy a fuel combustion engine wastes and might reasonably think: why not use that heat to make steam that powers a steam engine that adds power to the drivetrain? Engineers decades ago figured out that the complexity that adds to the overall system has too much of a diminishing return. Today’s engineers are a regression in their inability to avoid excessive complexity.
¹ To be fair, I don’t know if the machines were designed in Germany.. just that they are used in Germany and Denmark. Nonetheless Germans would have an expectation of high engineering standards to be deployed.
² KISS: Keep It Simple, Stupid.
My thoughts exactly!
Is it that you prefer not to insert coins, or that you prefer not to end up with coins? In principle a machine could take bills, but then you’d be getting coins back if you need change.
I’ve seen a laundromat with a centralized cash machine. You can insert as much in bills and coins as you want, then you tap the numbers of the machines you want to send the credit to. This single transaction made it easy if you needed to start ~3+ washing machines. If you plan diligently, you can ensure you don’t end up with coins, but then you need to bring coins.
I prefer coins because the rejection rate seems to be far lower than banknotes. But euro coins are probably more sensibly denominated than other countries. The US is a bit of an embarrassment in this regard because the $1 liberty coins never caught on, so people need a ton of quaters or small banknotes would can get quite ratty.
It would be wise to ban Danish universities from using Facebook. Students who do not use Facebook by choice are excluded from receiving some university announcements and information. It’s quite despicable that universities pressure students onto FB.
BTW, I could not read the article because it’s also exclusive.. jailed in Cloudflare. The tl;dr bot was useful.
1
mail2tor onion servers for IMAP and SMTP out of service for years (confirmation wanted!)
(mail2torjgmxgexntbrmhvgluavhj7ouul5yar6ylbvjkxwqf6ixkwyd.onion)
It’s not spontaneous shopping. People don’t walk around with dirty clothes either. A laundromat inside an apartment building for the residents living therein is not in the market for people walking around. Customers do not need to carry around cash and need not buy a special wallet because they are walking directly from their apartment to the basement on a planned basis. They can put the cash in a sandwich bag and set it on top of their clothes.
Cash is inherently inclusive.
Cash accepts all people without exception. So cash just works from all standpoints: socioeconomic, legal, and from an engineering point of view. If someone does not like to touch money, that’s not cash failing to work; that’s a manifestation of Tyranny of Convenience (as described by Tim Wu) by someone choosing not to touch money. Such consumers are their own problem. Laughable to call that preference an engineering failure.Banking is inherently exclusive.
Many demographics of people are involuntarily excluded. Banks have refused to open accounts for me. Banks are in the private sector and have a right to refuse service to people. European banks cannot refuse someone a “basic” account, but those basic accounts are not required to be free of charge and they cannot accept cash deposits so if you’re starting with cash such accounts are broken from the start. For people who banks accept there are countless disempowering circumstances consumers are forced to accept in return. Unlike those who don’t like to touch cash, people voluntarily objecting to banking have countless good compelling reasons for not pawning themselves.Banks violate human rights when they treat people differently based on their national origin. The privacy abuses actually also undermines human rights, as well as environmental harm inherent in forced periodic phone upgrades and in the banking industry’s fossil fuel investments. So when a consumer demands #forcedBanking because they don’t personally like the burden of carrying cash, it’s rather selfish that they prioritize some trivially esoteric convenience/novelty above human rights and also above people’s need to be free from nannies. So there is a very strong case for people to not bank by choice even if the bank accepts them. By comparison, it’s fair to dismiss anyone who supports forced banking simply on the basis of not liking the inconvenience of cash.
A forced banking design violates several rules of the IEEE Code of Ethics
The banking sector discriminates against people on the basis of national origin. So when an engineer designs as cashless system, they violate ¶7 of the IEEE code of ethics.