ProdigalFrog

joined 2 years ago
MODERATOR OF
[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 8 points 3 months ago (7 children)

Interesting, by your guidelines, there's quite some limits on expressing oneself to appease people who can easily avoid and skip over a clearly labeled piece of content.

From my perspective, it's as though someone came into a tavern and, fresh ale in hand, overheard a political discussion happening in a corner booth. Perhaps the subject was particularly distasteful to this theoretical tavern goer, and instead of ignoring it or moving to a seat where they can't hear it, they instead march up to said booth and demand these booth talkers cease their discussion immediately, explaining that they come to the tavern to relax, not have these political ideas pop up everywhere they go.

I suspect the people in the booth would be quite bewildered as to why this theoretical person is going to such trouble to involve themselves in ceasing an activity they could so easily avoid.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Wanted to come back to this after getting about halfway through the book so far, as well as finishing What Is Politics' series on the book (which, it turns out, only focus on the first 3 chapters). My conclusion is: they're kinda both right.

As someone who has never looked into anthropology, Dawn of Everything showcases some incredibly valuable history that I likely wouldn't have stumbled across by myself. The historic debate with Kandiaronk and his background in particular was exceptionally cool to read about, and the breadth of examples Graeber and Wengrow have to show all in one place is astounding.

What Is Politics' critique, though, does have merit IMO. There are a fair amount of times Dawn of Everything either misquotes, misleads, or withholds relevant context of the hunter gatherer tribes and cultures they reference. As an example, David & Wengrow suggest that cultures which experience only seasonal hierarchy are proof that these ancient cultures experimented with different forms of structuring society, but they left out the parts of the studies they reference to make those claims that show those seasonal hierarchies are absolutely not a conscious choice, but one that is quite clearly something the people being dominated by the hierarchy tolerate only due to environmental circumstance.

As an example, Marcel Mauss's study on the Eskimo: The Inuit experience somewhat egalitarian lives during the winter, and a more strict hierarchy during the summer where things become decidedly patriarchal, as the hunting men have full domination over their families. This is not out of choice by the women, but due to the seasonal change forcing their food supply (which concentrates in the winter) to disperse during the summer, leading individual families to venture out alone to continue to hunt game. This isolates women from their families which would normally act as a power equalizing effect against abusive or dominating husbands. The patriarchal domination does not appear to be a willing choice or experiment in any practical sense.

I also think it's odd that they seem to be suggesting that personal choice is what ultimately caused these egalitarian outcomes, but then also mention materialist reasons for why a culture might've stayed egalitarian, such as their reference to one tribe's use of a constantly shifting fertile river bank for agriculture as not lending itself to laying down territorial claims, which likely aided that culture in not becoming hierarchical.

What is Politics definitely is hyper materialist, but I think he makes a solid case in many of his critiques. His materialism does, however, seem to blind him to the solid argument Dawn of Everything makes that culture and conscious choice does seem capable of playing a large part in shaping society, such as the case of the differences between the Californian and Northwest coast native American tribes.

Without having finished the book, I can't make a final conclusion. But at least from what I've read so far, I'd put forward that environmental conditions do seem to have a not insignificant influence in determining whether an ancient society will lean toward becoming hierarchical or egalitarian, simply due to the conditions being more or less favorable to a group or individual gaining a foothold over others due to resource access. But culture and choice seem capable of playing a large part in that outcome as well.

I think ultimately Dawn of Everything is going to result in more regular folk becoming aware of the facts that our ancestors were fully capable of egalitarian societies and that it was in fact the norm until recent history, which is a terrific boon, and I'll certainly continue to recommend it for that reason alone. Though I think What is Politics' series is also enlightening, and a good companion piece to the book to fill out areas that Graeber & Wengrow likely got a bit wrong just due to the sheer size and complexity of the project.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 6 points 3 months ago (9 children)

Could you elaborate on that? If I'm understanding you correctly, you're suggesting it's identity politics to say publicly that a piece of media influenced your political views?

Are there cases where that doesn't apply? for example: "There Will Be Blood made me Anti-oil" or "How Nausica Valley of the Winds made me an Environmentalist", or "Grave of the Fireflys made me Anti-war". Are all of those conceptual titles equally verboten?

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 2 points 3 months ago
[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 3 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

I wasn't aware that they were particular magnets to drama. Our specific community does not allow Pro-Authoritarian content like the others appear to, and the slrpnk community itself is quite a chill corner of the lemmyverse, which likely contributes to our lack of drama.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 7 points 3 months ago

What 50 years?

Ah, typo in the title, cheers for mentioning it.

I didn't notice the link to Fritts at the bottom. He certainly does appear to beaten Cove.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 2 points 3 months ago (4 children)
[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 10 points 3 months ago (11 children)

In another comment below, I briefly describe the sort of political content the game has in it. It's not something a random leftist is projecting onto it, it's explicitly political content in the game itself, which is what is being discussed.

It's not really any different from discussing the themes or political content of Metal Gear Solid, Disco Elysium, or Planescape: Torment.

If that's not something you're interested, fair enough my friend! But surely it's not an inconvenience for others to discuss it? The title makes it clear what this is, which makes it pretty easy to avoid and scroll on to the next post.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 12 points 3 months ago (1 children)

The first part seems to be for people who are unfamiliar with the games. The political analysis begins at 19 minutes.

The games go into:

  • Discussion of monopolies, how they are used to exploit, and how they use state force to maintain their position to prevent competition
  • The Carrot character is an anarchist in the first game, who infiltrates the weather factory of the second game to document the exploitation of its workers. He then gives the player a quiz about US economics so that you can infiltrate a board of directors, but when he becomes a member of the board himself, becomes a liberal reformist.
  • In the third game, the devs put an easter egg only accessible by editing a config file with an obscure code, which adds police branded riot gear to the marching fascist candy soldiers, in a reference to the 1999 Seattle WTO Protests.
[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 10 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

The first part seems to be for people who are unfamiliar with the games. The political analysis begins at 19 minutes.

The games go into:

  • Discussion of monopolies, how they are used to exploit, and how they use state force to maintain their position to prevent competition
  • The Carrot character is an anarchist in the first game, who infiltrates the weather factory of the second game to document the exploitation of its workers. He then gives the player a quiz about US economics so that you can infiltrate a board of directors, but when he becomes a member of the board himself, becomes a liberal reformist.
  • In the third game, the devs put an easter egg only accessible by editing a config file with an obscure code, which adds police branded riot gear to the marching fascist candy soldiers, in a reference to the 1999 Seattle WTO Protests, which occurred 3 months before the release of the game.
[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 14 points 3 months ago (3 children)

It's pretty solid, and reveals things I never could've imagined the devs would put into the game. Loved it as a kid growing up, but I have a whole new appreciation for it now.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

Book transfers are supported by the device itself, no extra software required. It genuinely acts as a USB thumb drive once permission to give access to the PC is allowed on the device, similar to an Android phone. Once a book is put onto it and it's unplugged, it will automatically find the book and add it to the library screen.

The h2o model is also waterproof, which was a unique feature at the time, while the new Kobo models are all waterproof.

 
8
submitted 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago) by ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net to c/guns@lemmy.world
view more: ‹ prev next ›