Gorgritch_umie_killa

Ha, cheese addiction has gotta be a thing with dogs.

My dog knows the sound the cheese container makes very well. That fuckers come in from outside when we've got that container out in the past.

I've stopped giving him cheese now, (i think i read its toxic for dogs), so he doesn't care so much about when we get it out. I wonder if the sound gives him happy reminiscences though?

Its gettin put through the crusher as soon as posession is taken.

Na! All good! It was a nice convo, glad i got to have a re-read of Elinor Ostram, i'm gona have to get her book one of these days!

Lol, i thought this was some kind of erotic-manga museum and was super confused why this would be in Australia.

I honestly thought Hastie was a more canny politician than he is coming out as since the election. What does he mean,

"This motion — moved and supported by my division of Canning — reflects a growing concern from mainstream Australians about our expensive energy bills, unreliable supply, and the erosion of our national sovereignty," Mr Hastie said in the email.

Does he mean 'Mainstream' Australians support his net zero, and welcome to country culture war? Thats such an incoherent statement in the face of their election loss, they have to get back to real policy.

Its a shame, because i think Hastie could be really strong and in a productive way in opposition on defence, but if he's seeking relevance through culture wars like this, then he's lost the plot.

All you and I have said in essence doesn't matter.

Their problem is the crimes they are committing in Gaza now. They could be the most enlightened unicorns the world has seen, they are still committing the heinous crime of starvation and mass punishment, and about a third of their 'enemy' seem to be children, you don't wipe your hands of this, and we don't let them.

Israel doesn't have values like our own, maybe at some point the two countries were more aligned in that respect. Our history is sordid, and we continue to have problems and always will. We are changing as a nation, slowly, but i live in a very different country, and better, than i grew up in.

We don't have to choose a best mate in the middle east, thats okay, i never tried to say any were better. We're a world away and can afford to keep all at arms length, thats a choice we can make.

So i think the equivalences you draw aren't useful. Israel is a nation committing crimes against humanity, compare their actions against UN conventions, or the Rome Statute, etc..

Oh, and stock markets tend to do well when governments flush the econony with cash. It shouldn't be a surprise that Israel's stock market is doing well while their government spends money on weapons, manpower, et al, to attack its neighbours.

I've never claimed the other side are full of lovely people, thats not point. There you go again with your equivalences. Let me explain, when one person murders a brother and that victim's brother then goes and murders the original murderers brother, two crimes have been committed, and each murderer is answerable for their crimes. You ikplicitly advocate eye for an eye with your tacit support of Israels actions. Eye for an eye simply leads to ongoing feuds, as we see a lot of with Israel and their neighbours, time for a different approach.

You're a massive fan of Israel obviously, but try looking at the experience from the other side. The crimes they've committed aren't forgotten, theres a long history there, and it doesn't do anyone well to ignore one side in favour of the other. The colonial take over of that land, the ongoing persecution of the people i've already mentioned isn't absolved because they've had crimes committed against them. Its perplexing that i have to restate this.

My point about NZ is they're the only country we can rely on to a high degree, not whatever you think i said about their miltary and technological capability. I've said this a couple different ways now.

I think the disconnect is your impressed and argue that we should cleave to powerful allies, whereas i'm impressed and argue that we should cleave to those willing to uphold some semblance of moral values. Until we both realise we aren't valuing the same things here, we won't be able to see the others point of view.

All you said about Israel's economy was a bit wasted, i actually accounted for that and didn't dismiss it. But to ignore the fact their close relationship and support from the United States, and European countries like Britain and France and their efforts in building up that place as an 'unsinkable aircraft carrier' misses the point of why their economy is so 'blessed'. I find it incredible you would ignore that. There are few economies that can sustainably pull themselves up without massive support from benefactors, Israel isn't incredible, its a natural outcome of continued unquestioning investment and support. My point is, thats been put at risk, and made harder since their behaviour since Oct 7th, and now they aren't materially different from their neighbours in that regard.

Left wing progressives don't tend to let go of things. They've been on this train for a long time. I generally find its good to listen to those people, they aren't shunted off on a different tangent like the rest of society so easily is. Thats my experience with left wing progresssives, maybe we've had different interactions there.

Ah yes, it's the israeli's fault they don't subscribe to a backwards religion, treat their women like cattle, and spend most of their time praying to a god that doesn't exist instead of working to improve diplomatic relations and business capacity of their own countries.

Thats just weird to call a country founded on a religion thats older than Islam, and quite closely related in many ways not backwards, if Islam is a backwards religion then the same can be said of Judaism and Christianity.

Most of what you said there can just as easily be laid at Israel's feet. Sans treat their women like cattle, but they treat other humans, like arab Israelis, or Gazans, or west bankers like cattle, so they aren't any better, they just target different groups.

But I don't blame these peoples religions for any of their immoral behaviours, its not the religion that makes a crap human, its their lack of empathy and morals to those they deem as other to their own.

As far as improving diplomatic relations, and improving business capacity Israel should also listen to that advice. Their actions since October 7th have vanished all semblance of a 'most moral army' concept. Their actions before Oct 7th were already leading to hard questions about colonialism. They've materially hurt their international business prospects to a level akin to coal companies, this effects things like borrrowing capacity, complicates expansion and mergers in a less friendly world, they are costs that must be borne. Of course their great benefactor, USA, will ease this pain a great deal but even they can only do so much.

Take these much vaunted Abraham Accords, the autocrat MBS is now in a position where to proceed with them could destabilize their piece of shit regime due to the ill feeling in Arab nations about the treatment of Gazans. So if international diplomacy and business relations were really that important here, Israel again is just as bad as the rest.

Take their judicial system, it has been undermined by its executive branch time and again, making a mockery of a 'rule of law', something pretty essential to inspire business investment. Not to mention the lack of justice the aforementioned Arab-Israelis, and Palestinians recieve.

Their key difference, it seems, is again they have the force of the worlds largest military, and possibly largest economy full square behind them, allowing Israel to defy gravity. But lets not believe they are any better, its long since past that those arguments could be made.

I'll have a read of the South Korea contract piece, looks interesting.

If you want the best from 'allies' then the US should have been the partner of choice in most of that little list.

Your thoughts on Israel are tiring, a refusal to see a genocide when it is happening in front of you is sad. I hope one day you'll recognise the ridiculousness of your equivalences with their far less powerful neighbours. Even if you could prove a genocide against Israel by those neighbours (which cant be done), one genocide doesn't absolve another genocide. A crime against humanity stands as a black mark against those who sink to those levels of depravity.

The reason NZ is the partner of choice, is because they are the only nation we can rely on. I alluded to this earlier, my view is we should accept less influence, but be more able to protect ourselves. Essentially we have become too reliant on the alliance structure as a means of securing our power and prosperity, to a fault. I advocate a paring back of this reliance, which inherently means a trade off of international power, but means we will be a more reliable partner, and not a subject, in a conflict.

Edit: less of a subject

We shouldn't rely on nations willing to commit genocide for anything. Therefore Israel is a non-starter, and must be treated with caution and distance from here on in all levels of engagement.

A concentration on domestic, or near neighbour manufacturing should be our focus. The European powers are probably more reliable in terms of not letting sudden political values changes, shred their military alliances, but their ability to supply a nation on the other side of the world limits the extent we can rely on such partnerships.

In other words, we can rely on New Zealand absolutely, then other nations to much lesser degrees than we have been, in terms of maintaining a secure logistical supply of our essential ADF technology. This means I do think we have to completely re-engineer our defense force, and community expectations around what our military is capable of delivering.

Our military has been artificially propped up to a more capable technology level than our country has prepared to be able to maintain, in a world where might makes right, that means our sovereignty is beholden to the whims of our senior suppliers. I'd like more independence of manoeuvre than that.

Isn't the problem with ICBMs that a tarfet nation doesn't necessarily know its non-nuclear and therefore you get into a sprt of game theory situation where the strongest possible answer is the only coreect answer?