this post was submitted on 24 Feb 2024

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University vending machine error reveals use of secret facial recognition | A malfunctioning vending machine at a Canadian university has inadvertently revealed that a number of them have been usin... (www.theguardian.com)

submitted 2 years ago by L4s@lemmy.world to c/technology@lemmy.world

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[–] kalkulat@lemmy.world 16 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

AND they might have had miniature cameras in them for the past 20 years.

(The laws against this stuff are almost non-existing. Option left for those of us creeped out by constant surveillance: don't leave home, unplug that webcam. Demand privacy or lose it.)

[–] autotldr@lemmings.world 14 points 2 years ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:

A malfunctioning vending machine at a Canadian university has inadvertently revealed that a number of them have been using facial recognition technology in secret.

Invenda, the company that produces the machines, advertises its use of “demographic detection software”, which it says can determine gender and age of customers.

It claims the technology is compliant with GDPR, the European Union’s privacy standards, but it is unclear whether it meets Canadian equivalents.

In April, the national retailer Canadian Tire ran afoul of privacy laws in British Columbia after it used facial recognition technology without notifying customers.

The government’s privacy commissioner said that even if the stores had obtained permission, the company failed to show a reasonable purpose for collecting facial information.

The University of Waterloo pledged in a statement to remove the Invenda machines “as soon as possible”, and that in the interim, it had “asked that the software be disabled”.

The original article contains 258 words, the summary contains 149 words. Saved 42%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

[–] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago

Hey hey - y'all quit hanging around the vending machines! You're going to be late for the two minutes of hate!

[+] TrumpetX@programming.dev -26 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Everyone seems concerned about what it could be doing, not what it is doing.

I could sit next to a vending machine and make notes on the gender and sex of each patron for demographic purposes, nothing would be illegal.

Why? Well, that's easy, I want to stock my vending machine in order to make money. Instead of testing different layouts which would take a lot of time, I could predict how well certain stock would do based on preexisting market research.

This appears to be just that, but with a camera.

Now, you can argue "but it could be worse"! That's not a valid argument. It could always be worse for things you don't know about. If it holds up to be true, as stated, it's just what it is.

[–] n2burns@lemmy.ca 18 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Bad analogy. If you were doing what you said, but instead of taking notes, you were using a camera, you'd quickly get a visit from the UW Special Constable Service who'd probably transfer you to WRPS.

EDIT: Even if you were just taking notes on people, it's possible you'd experience the same process.

[–] kebabslob@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 years ago

Fed

[–] markon@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Lol people get so worked up and don't know shit. We're all just apes with a god complex.

[+] Greg@lemmy.ca -85 points 2 years ago (8 children)

This seems like an over reaction by people who don't understand the technology or associated risks. Focus on the implementation not the tech. There is no indication that the vending machine is inappropriatly storing or transmitting personally identifiable information or that its making decisions based on biased data.

[–] BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 37 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Hahahahahahahahahahahahajaja

Total "trust me bro" take.

I have the keys to your house, but there's no evidence I'm using them inappropriately.

I never say this, but go lick some more boot.

[–] the_tab_key@lemmy.world 27 points 2 years ago (1 children)

This is a pretty "generous" take. I ask you then: if the company isn't doing communicating any of the scans/recordings, what is the purpose of the technology being installed in the first place?

[–] Greg@lemmy.ca -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Marketing is often targeted, especially online (which is a huge privacy issue). I would guess they are using the data from these vending machines to measure the success of their marketing campaigns.

[–] the_tab_key@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Like I said: generous. You are "guess"ing that what they are doing with it is above board. I'm not that trusting of corporations.

People trusted Boeing would put planes together with the utmost concern for safety... Then a fucking for feel off mid-flight.

[–] Greg@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 year ago

The FAA failed to regulate Boeing. I'm pro regulation and laws that protect people's privacy. And if this company and the individuals within it break the law they should receive appropriate punishments with fines tied to international revenue.

My point is that the laws should relate to privacy independent of the technology. The "ban face recognition" narrative misses the point and doesn't address the threats. Facial recognition technology can be used in ways that don't threaten individuals privacy and non facial recognition technologies can be a threat to individual privacy.

It's cynical to assume this company is breaking privacy with no evidence. But it's fair to say there needs to be greater punishments and regulations

[–] billiam0202@lemmy.world 16 points 2 years ago

There is no indication that the vending machine is inappropriatly storing or transmitting personally identifiable information or that its making decisions based on biased data.

And until the machine malfunctioned, there was no indication that the vending machine was collecting any data at all. Businesses can say whatever they want in the court of public opinion, but until these same claims are made in a court of law they should be considered lies to placate the public.

Furthermore, why even collect such data if it's not meant to be utilized? They already know what the most popular products are (since they know what they restock the most) so for what reason do they need to collect demographics?

[–] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Says a guy who doesn't hide his real name, face, and location for his online persona. You have no concept of digital privacy.

[–] Greg@lemmy.ca -4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Arguing that I have no concept of digital privacy because I choose to share my name and face is an ignorant statement and demonstrates how little you understand the concept of online privacy. For context, I work in tech in Canada, I deal with GDPR and other compliances. I understand the technology, the risks, and the attack vectors. These vending machines are not a serious threat to individuals privacy. Facebook, Google, Amazon, are serious threats. Focus your energy on the actual risks instead of making uninformed comments.

[–] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Did 2yo Marisol also make an informed choice to share her identity and location on the fediverse?

This vending machine is taking biometrics off of everyone who walks past it and you don't think that's the least bit concerning?

GDPR doesn't apply in Canada unless you are trying to operate business in Europe.

Compliance only matters if you can't afford a fine. If you can make more money violating regulations than the cost of the fine, it's just a business expense.

[–] Greg@lemmy.ca -3 points 2 years ago

You pretend to care about consent and privacy and then mention my daughter by name here. You'll notice I share photos and details about my daughter from accounts on servers I control. There is an implicit agreement in the fediverse to respect people's privacy. I obviously don't rely on that implicit agreement because some people do unethical things as demonstrated in your post. I protect my daughter from legitimate online privacy and security threats, I don't play privacy and security theatre.

This vending machine is taking biometrics off of everyone who walks past

You have no evidence of this and there is no mention of this in the article. This also doesn't make any sense from an implementation perspective.

GDPR doesn’t apply in Canada unless you are trying to operate business in Europe.

You're correct that GDPR doesn't apply in Canada, it's just that GDPR is usually the strictest compliance so it's usual for companies to meet that compliance as a minimum.

Compliance only matters if you can’t afford a fine.

GDPR fines can be tied to global revenue.

When your beliefs don't align with the facts, consider changing your beliefs instead of doubling down on your opinions, making things up, and doing unethical things. Please try better.

[–] Luci@lemmy.ca 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

This is the first step to charging a different price based on demographic.

[–] nodsocket@lemmy.world -3 points 2 years ago

Go back to reddit Greg.