I'd like to think that the mere fact that Trump is facing this absolute litany of charges would be enough to drive any reasonable people away in droves, but clearly that applies too much rational thought for many of my fellow countrymen
this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2024
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Everyone who could be swayed has already been peeled away or never voted for him in the first place. All that's left are the people who would vote for literally any Republican and those who think God sent him.
The real problem is that that's still tens of millions of people, including a terrifying amount of electoral college votes.
Yeah, I really don't understand this claim. Why would his being found guilty of things that everyone but his most die-hard supporters know he's obviously guilty of change people's votes?
Getting it to trial before the election is not the issue, getting the conviction and sentencing will be.
Criminal trials aren't going to be like the in and out civil trials where he has already been found liable and they just need to determine by how much (E. Jean Carroll and the Trump Org, or even the Rudy Giuliani defamation trial). There was no question of guilt or innocence.
His lawyers will, and already have, pull every trick in the book to delay, delay, delay.
If you're trying to keep track of where we're at in the Trump prosecutions:
Updated 01/29/2024
Washington, D.C.
4 federal felonies
January 6th Election Interference
Investigation
Indictment
Arrest <- You Are Here
Trial - March 4th, 2024, one day before Super Tuesday primaries.
Jack Smith had requested that the Supreme Court immediately rule on Trump's immunity defense, the Court rejected the request, requiring it to go through the usual appeals process first.
Conviction
Sentencing
New York
34 state felonies
Stormy Daniels Payoff
Investigation
Indictment
Arrest <- You Are Here
Trial - March 25th, 2024
Conviction
Sentencing
Florida
40 federal felonies
Top Secret Documents charges
Investigation
Indictment
Original indictment was for 37 felonies.
3 new felonies were added on July 27, 2023.
Arrest <- You Are Here
Trial - May 20, 2024
Conviction
Sentencing
Georgia
13 state felonies
Election Interference
Investigation
Indictment
Arrest <- You Are Here
All 19 defendants have surrendered.
Trial - A trial date of Aug. 5, 2024 has been requested, not approved yet.
Three defendants, Kenneth Chesebro, Sidney Powell, and bail bondsman Scott Hall, have all pled guilty and have agreed to testify in other cases.
The judge in the case has set a deadline of December 1st for all motions to be filed, expect a trial date at some point after that.
Conviction
Sentencing
Other grand juries, such as for the documents at Bedminster, or the Arizona fake electors, have not been announced.
The E. Jean Carroll trial for sexual assault and defamation where Trump was found liable and ordered to pay $5 million before immediately defaming her again resulting in a demand for $10 million is not listed as it's a civil case and not a crimimal one. He was found liable in that case for $83.3 million.
As a function of the January 6th and Georgia trials, there are now lawsuits in two states to bar Trump from the primary ballot based on the insurrection clause of the 14th Amendment.
Colorado:
12/19/23 - The Colorado Supreme Court has ruled that Trump is not eligible for the primary ballot due to being barred by the 14th Amendment as an insurrectionist.
Minnesota:
11/8/2023 - State Supreme Court denies challenge, allows ballot access.
A long-shot write in candidate for President has also filed suits seeking to bar Trump from the ballot in Florida, Kansas, Montana, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Utah, Wisconsin and Wyoming.
His cases in Arizona, California, Idaho, Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, and West Virginia have been thrown out:
https://www.wmur.com/article/new-hampshire-donald-trump-ballot-lawsuit-dismiss/45682757
Holy shit dude, this is a great list, well done
He's already a convicted rapist and no one seems to care on the right.
TeChNiCaLlY, unless I missed something big, he wasn't convicted of the rape. That requires a criminal trial. A jury did find that he raped her as a material fact in a civil trial, so we can say with legal certainty that it happened, but until an actual conviction, it will be used as a excuse to avoid holding him to account for it. Of course a bunch of the right are the type to blame the victim or wave it off entirely for that particular crime anyway so I don't know how much difference even a conviction would make to them.
thank you for the clarification. Looking into definitions, evidently the word "convicted" only refers to criminal proceedings, as you say.
Yeah you're right and I think we're looking for civily liable instead of conviction in this scenario - not that it should make a difference.
The technicalities can get weird, but it makes a huge difference. In the US (it works differently in different legal systems) even the defendant's basic constitutional rights are different between civil and criminal proceedings. For example you can't plead the 5th (invoke the right to not be compelled to provide incriminating evidence against yourself) in a civil trial because your testimony couldn't incriminate when the trial's not criminal. Any evidence gathered this way in a civil trial is therefore inadmissible in a criminal trial about the same matters. That's why Bill Cosby got his rape conviction overturned on appeal. A lot of the criminal case against him was based on evidence he was compelled to give when he got sued over it earlier, so it shouldn't have been allowed in the criminal trial. The appeal didn't find him innocent, just that the conviction had to be thrown out because the process had violated his rights.
I was referring to the perception from the results of the trial by the public, but you've given me quite a bit to mull over. Appreciate the context.
But just to avoid being overtechnical, if you want to say Trump raped Carroll, you can accurately say so:
A judge has now clarified that this is basically a legal distinction without a real-world difference. He says that what the jury found Trump did was in fact rape, as commonly understood.
The filing from Judge Lewis A. Kaplan came as Trump’s attorneys have sought a new trial and have argued that the jury’s $5 million verdict against Trump in the civil suit was excessive. The reason, they argue, is that sexual abuse could be as limited as the “groping” of a victim’s breasts.
Kaplan roundly rejected Trump’s motion Tuesday, calling that argument “entirely unpersuasive.”
“The finding that Ms. Carroll failed to prove that she was ‘raped’ within the meaning of the New York Penal Law does not mean that she failed to prove that Mr. Trump ‘raped’ her as many people commonly understand the word ‘rape,’ ” Kaplan wrote.
He added: “Indeed, as the evidence at trial recounted below makes clear, the jury found that Mr. Trump in fact did exactly that.”
Kaplan said New York’s legal definition of “rape” is “far narrower” than the word is understood in “common modern parlance.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/07/19/trump-carroll-judge-rape/
I don’t believe it. Anybody who today is planning to vote for that moron probably also believes that every single charge is part of some elaborate witch hunt.
There is not one reasonable, rational person who is still backing Trump.
It's not about the die hards. They are already lost. It's about the undecided. Which is about 80 percent of the voting population. Swaying them is the game.
Which is why all of 45’s legal issues needed to be fast tracked, at the least.
I do not understand the lack of urgency in these matters.
Several of the judges involved in the various cases are Trump sycophants trying to deliberately delay proceedings.
Aileen Cannon I think is the only one. Who else?
Trump supporters will rely on denial to justify their vote. "He was unfairly persecuted, it's all a dem witch hunt, etc etc." Politics is all about your team winning these days. They'll turn out either way.
Oh yeah prosecutors could have gotten to trial years ago, but they dragged their feet. And continue to.
There's a reason they are manufacturing a crisis on the border now. They know Trump is weak and likely to crumble. He's showing signs already. They are silent on the Carol case since they want the distraction anywhere but on Trump himself.
They are getting scared of being crushed.
There actually is a crisis at the border. Someone here thought the same as you, but then looked at the numbers of incoming immigrants and it was stunning.
You can see some numbers here: The number of immigrants turned away or apprehended at borders reached 2.8 million in FY 2022, the highest number since at least 1980. Note the spike in the accompanying graph.
I have nothing to back this, but my guess is that potential immigrants are thinking or being told, "Get to America now in case Trump becomes President again."
But Hitler went to jail after his coup attempt..
Hitler was 34 years old at the time. Trump is 78…
Of course there will be those who don't care.
But not his entire voter base is made up of those brainwashed weirdos. To some he will lose respect if he has been convicted. So I can see it happening.
He votes in Florida right? So if he's a convicted felon he can't vote in Florida right? That just makes me giggle.