this post was submitted on 21 Jan 2024
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I've seen a lot of posts here on Lemmy, specifically in the "fuck cars" communities as to how Electric Vehicles do pretty much nothing for the Climate, but I continue to see Climate activists everywhere try pushing so, so hard for Electric Vehicles.

Are they actually beneficial to the planet other than limiting exhaust, or is that it? or maybe exhaust is a way bigger problem?

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[–] flamingo_pinyata@sopuli.xyz 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Exhaust and noise are still a problem. It won't do much on a climate level, but even if we manage to reduce car usage having the remaining cars be electric is useful. Both noise pollution and particulate pollution have negative effects on human health.

Maybe it's just my bubble but most climate activists I see are primarily pushing for renewable electricity generation, and consumption reduction across the board in all aspects of life. They are usually also against cars generally but it's a secondary subject.

[–] Auzy@beehaw.org 2 points 2 years ago

It will actually have a huge impact on noise imho. I live near a intersection between 2 freeways, and lots of REALLY loud cars out there due to stupidly sized engines, or modified mufflers.. The majority of the noise isn't the movement of the car imho.

Also, it does have an impact on the climate too (it's been researched multiple times, and even with current tech, the overall emissions are substantially lower). Obviously Public Transport and Bicycles and such is better, but this is still a huge step in the right direction.

In fact, if technologies like Lithium-Air are developed, it will have an even bigger impact (because you can effectively reduce the battery weight 15x with the same range). Because you can also reduce the size of the car too, and the weight, you increase the efficiency further too. Sodium ion batteries being released this year already have an impact.

[–] Omega_Haxors@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 years ago

They're marginally better but we don't need marginally better, we need to get our shit together right now.

[–] HorseWithNoName@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago

Lithium mining is not good for the environment.

[–] carl_dungeon@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (3 children)

The #1 problem with EVs is not the energy and materials used to create the battery because that is eclipsed many times over by not using gas during the battery’s life- the biggest problem is that the entire car becomes e-waste as soon as the battery is damaged or degraded in any way.

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/yikes-the-60000-hyundai-ioniq-5-battery-replacement-saga-continues-226590.html

https://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/florida-family-electric-car-problem-replacement-battery-costs-more-vehicle

[–] ShadowRam@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The replacing the battery is simply a supply issue.

There is such a demand and so little supply, that if you want to buy just a battery (and not the entire car) you are out of luck. They'll put that battery in a new car and sell it before selling it to you as a replacement.

But that's short term. There are a huge number of battery plants already breaking ground and coming online.

In 2 years or so, the price to replace the battery will be a HELL of a lot lower, and the issue you linked above will be long gone.

[–] carl_dungeon@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I hope so but I doubt it. It’s not the price that’s so much of an issue but the fact that the packs are non-standard, non-serviceable, and the car is worthless without it. Manufacturers make money selling their own custom batteries at markup. It’ll take government regulation to force companies to begin using a modular system because there is literally negative incentive for manufactures to do it on their own.

[–] ShadowRam@kbin.social 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

government regulation to force companies to begin using a modular system

Yeah, that's fair. But the issue is also similar to cell phones.

Each battery is unique because it needs to fit the unique layout of the vehicle. Not to mention the battery tech is moving so fast, that the chemistry of the battery itself is changing every few years.

I suspect China's approach to a vehicle where you hot-swap the batteries instead of charging will be the way it goes. Someone will do it, it will be most $$$ efficient and therefore profitable, and then it will force them all to adopt the same approach.

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[–] charonn0@startrek.website 2 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Not if there are going to be hundreds of millions of them, no.

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[–] rufus@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

There are studies after what kind of mileage an EV outperforms a regular car.

But the question is: Where do you get your electricity from? Is it regenerative energy?

[–] Uranium3006@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

the thing is that EVs are agnostic to their energy source. you could get 100% from your own home solar panel setup if you wanted to

[–] rufus@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Sure. I meant you have to pay attention and do it right. In theory you can do all kinds of things. Drive super dirty vehicles to none at all and use your bicycle and the train. But the actual CO2 emissions depend on what we all actually decide to do. A solar panel would be a excellent. Especially if you live in the south where you get plenty of sun.

[–] Meatballs@mander.xyz 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

We rape Africa for those metals the in a similar way we've been raping the middle east for oil. I guarantee once the US starts mandating EVs and the majority start to transition over there will suddenly be some reason we need to have a vested military presence in Africa, with the possibility of wars centered around countries with these metals that we need.

It's better for air quality and would do a shitload towards giving us some spare time to process climate change, but they come with their own baggage of bullshit in terms of environmental damage.

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[–] DirigibleProtein@aussie.zone 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What is the carbon footprint, particularly of the batteries, during both manufacture and disposal. How does that compare to internal combustion engines?

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