this post was submitted on 05 Dec 2023
77 points (92.3% liked)

World News

48889 readers
1570 users here now

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


Lemmy World Partners

News !news@lemmy.world

Politics !politics@lemmy.world

World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world


Recommendations

For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Sellafield, Europe’s most hazardous nuclear site, has a worsening leak from a huge silo of radioactive waste that could pose a risk to the public, the Guardian can reveal.

Concerns over safety at the crumbling building, as well as cracks in a reservoir of toxic sludge known as B30, have caused diplomatic tensions with countries including the US, Norway and Ireland, which fear Sellafield has failed to get a grip of the problems.

top 16 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] VieuxQueb@lemmy.ca -5 points 2 years ago (6 children)

And yet I keep seeing push for nuclear energy in the news stating it as 'clean' energy ? Is it clean or dangerously radioactive ? They outa set their minds in the news. I personally despise creating pollution that will last longer than a generation. Why put onto others the repercussions of our own comfort ?

The same people calling nuclear clean argue that solar and wind is polluting. I would rather have the pollution of a solar and wind production in my backyard than nuclear waste.

[–] Sewer_King@lemmy.world 21 points 2 years ago

From my understanding, it's considered clean by comparison to fossil fuels in that it's easier to contain the byproducts that nuclear produces since they are primarily solid and liquid waste compared to the additional gaseous waste that fossil fuels make. The problem is in the potency of the pollution, the length of time that it needs to be stored, and while I said that it was fairly easy to store, that doesn't stop storage facilities from doing what the lowest bidder tends to do which is perform below the minimum expectation. The quantity of the waste is typically lower by tonnage compared to fossil fuels and a good chunk of nuclear waste is in the form of contaminated safety equipment that has reached the end of it's expected life cycle.

Something has to go horribly wrong for dangerous nuclear contamination to happen, but that's not to say that things can and have gone horribly wrong.

[–] BenadrylChunderHatch@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Problems like this are just handwaved away because nuclear waste could in theory be safely disposed of. In the cases where is hasn't been the pro nuclear guys just say "well if they did it properly it wouldn't be an issue", which might be true but if countries like the UK, US and Germany have had issues, you have to ask if its really realistic to assume that the problem will always be dealt with properly.

The other answer is some future tech reactor that hasn't been built on any real world scale that runs on nuclear waste and produces none. Great idea in theory but how does it compare with renewables in terms of cost?

[–] xor@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 2 years ago

The frustrating thing is that, in classic UK fashion, these problems are almost entirely self-inflicted by privatisation, with the company responsible trying to do it as cheaply as possible, even if that means half-assing it.

This exact same site was in the news yesterday(!) as well for having long term cyber security vulnerabilities.

[–] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago

This site isn't one of the safer newer types, it's an old build that was used for weapons as well, and it's currently in the process of being decommissioned. Nuclear isn't perfect by any means, but it can be improved to a point where it's one of several acceptable options and it is gradually maturing.

A big problem with nuclear has been the highly bespoke nature of each build. Increased standardisation of designs will improve safety as well as cost.

You are right that the news doesn't really have a sensible take. But we know reasonable and consistent information isn't where their profit motives are aligned.

[–] BastingChemina@slrpnk.net 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

If we play "I would rather", I would rather have a nuclear waste facility than a copper, lithium or cobalt mine in my garden.

The transition to renewables energy will requires A LOT of mining and mines are awful for the environment.

At least with nuclear waste we can try to contain it, mining waste is just left in the open and pollute the land and water with heavy metals.

We don't talk much about the environmental impact of mining because it mostly impact low income country and there is no clean mining, so the only way to reduce the impact of mining is to reduce our consumption, but no one wants to hear about that. Globally we prefer pretending that we can transform our consumption to be sustainable

The only clean energy is the one that we don't use, after that there is just a list of less worse alternatives, nuclear, solar and wind are on the "less worse" category but they still have a terrible impact on the environment.

[–] PainInTheAES@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I don't think it's one or the other. Nuclear is part of a comprehensive green energy plan. That's because nuclear is the only thing that can currently fill the gap left by coal or gas. Solar and wind need extensive battery infrastructure to be effective in this regard. Mass battery plants will also cause some form of generational waste. Coal and gas cause massive generational waste and coal ash is radioactive.

Obviously solar and wind are going to be safer but nuclear being safe and dangerously radioactive is both true and depends on how well the plant is managed and how old it is. Nuclear accidents rightfully get a lot of coverage but a well run reactor is pretty clean. How does the environmental damage stack up in kW/damage vs coal and oil?

Hydro is pretty great though. And I guess fusion if that ever goes anywhere.

[–] derGottesknecht@feddit.de 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Nuclear Reactors have a certain Limit on Powercycles. While you can power up an down with up to 10%/min that puts a huge amount of stress on all parts which leads to cracks and leaks. So you can't actually replace the flexibility of gas powerplants with nuclear, because the risk associated with leaks is so much worse.

[–] PainInTheAES@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That's fair, I was kinda thinking base power generation by nuclear and solar/wind for peaks. But the solar and wind probably wouldn't be reliable enough so would still need some gas in the mix.

[–] derGottesknecht@feddit.de 3 points 2 years ago

The reliability issue of regenerative energy can be lessend with better grids, because somwhere is always wind or sun. And then adding different storage technologies like battery, pressurised air or thermal storage should get us to a reliable power supply without emissions in the next decades.

[–] Sewer_King@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Hydro is kinda devastating to any environment it touches if the scale is large enough. I think that it's usually pretty good on a micro scale that doesn't have to throttle waterways and flood others.

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 5 points 2 years ago

For this reason, tidal hydro is great. All of the benefits of hydro, none of the environmental ruin of dams.

They are obviously gonna be much less efficient than dams but there's so much coast line to be taken advantage of.

https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/hydropower/tidal-power.php

[–] MonkderZweite@feddit.ch -2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It's still fossil energy, except that the pollution doesn't get into the air.

[–] crane228@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What fossil is uranium made from?

[–] Sylvartas@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Come on, you know what they meant. It's "fossil" as a shorthand for "non-renewable"

[–] MonkderZweite@feddit.ch 1 points 2 years ago

My bad, sorry.