this post was submitted on 21 Nov 2023
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Ukraine

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[–] petrescatraian@libranet.de 15 points 2 years ago (2 children)

@Ulara the US and pretty much everyone in the world became spoiled about how warfare should be fought. Probably there's also the memory of WW2 when entire cities were leveled to 0 in bombings and shelling, so the alternative of carrying an urban fight became more desirable. Despite this, Russia seems to not care about this fact and actually bomb and level entire cities and other settlements to the ground instead.

[–] Dead_or_Alive@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The US knew that our small arms ammunition stockpiles were inadequate after the second battle of Fallujah. I don’t think they realized that extended all the way to our heavier munitions.

The other problem is that our European allies have woefully inadequate stockpiles of everything. If a shooting war broke out they would be a liability. France and Britain proved this during their air campaign over Libya.

[–] breakfastmtn@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The US just doesn't have an artillery-centered military like Russia and Ukraine though. It's very unlikely they'd be in a war like this. It makes me wonder if the headline is overstating things and that ramping up production is primarily about topping up allies. Another interesting thing about this war is that air denial has been more significant than air superiority. Russia should (on paper at least) have been able to establish air superiority and they just haven't been able to at any point. I'm curious how much that is seen as a new reality of warfare and whether this represents a slight change in US strategy, which is focused so heavily on air power and air superiority.

[–] Dead_or_Alive@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

We don’t but no nation except the US is capable of SEAD operations that allow uncontested control of the air. Against a near peer we might not be able to suppress air defenses across all fronts and would need to fall back on artillery.

[–] Ulara@sopuli.xyz 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Another reason is that it is much more interesting and impressive to create some super advanced and costly tech instead of maintaining huge stockpiles of simpler materiel.

[–] petrescatraian@libranet.de 2 points 2 years ago

@Ulara well, it's more effective to have one shot-one strike than to try getting collateral damage all the way until you hit the target, so getting high-tech in normal weapons does make sense from this point of view.

[–] neuropean@kbin.social 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Long and protracted war is not part of the US doctrine. There’s a reason Iraq didn’t last very long, the US aims to destroy before they could really establish fortified positions.

[–] sonori@beehaw.org 4 points 2 years ago

Depends on how you count the air war, but the point stands. For some strange reason the US likes to contest things in places where they have a massive tech advantage instead of slugging it out trench to trench.

[–] galloog1@lemmy.world 9 points 2 years ago

Production increase is the number one reason I see as giving ammunition to Ukraine as an overall good thing. Long term contacts to spy Ukraine and replenish greater stocks to be ready for a war in SE Asia. Not giving out the contacts and not giving to Ukraine is not going to make us more ready contrary to the America first narratives.

Additionally, ammunition does not last forever. It expires and becomes less effective. Everything needed replacing.

We need greater and smarter manufacturing at scale.