this post was submitted on 09 Apr 2026
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https://mas.to/@carnage4life/116370362572010064

the article is real, but I'm not gonna link it

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[–] Glytch@lemmy.world 3 points 6 hours ago* (last edited 6 hours ago)

This is a great example of Betteridge's law of headlines. Did wokeness leave us worse off? No.

[–] TassieTosser@aussie.zone 1 points 5 hours ago

Aren't the "opinions" basically blogs? The NYT started that garbage years ago to farm clicks.

[–] MrsDoyle@sh.itjust.works 3 points 7 hours ago

My stance is: you can say what you like, but I am going to judge you by your words.

I can't stand that line of "oooh, you can't say anything these days", it's absolute bullshit.

[–] Luisp@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 8 hours ago

woke is when I can't say the n word -nytimes

[–] zuana@lemmy.world 23 points 15 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago)

RECENTLY?? Did you not see the 2 years of, "Biden incompetent because old, Kamila incompetent because woman" articles? It's blatantly been run by, or at least edited by, conservatives just based on the open front and center messaging. All legacy media is seemly operated by Republicans constantly thrashing the left and empowering the right. Making the left comfortable with openly supporting the fascist right has been their number 1 goal for the last several years.

[–] Sam_Bass@lemmy.world 19 points 15 hours ago

Theyre asking the questions their fascist masters want them to ask

The nyt was literally foubded in a fit of reaction. They are always on the wrong side of history.

[–] sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com 28 points 19 hours ago (1 children)

The NYT's editorial board is the CIA, change my mind.

[–] SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 14 points 18 hours ago (1 children)
[–] TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world 4 points 15 hours ago (2 children)

Has been since forever. Remember when NYT ran an article that Hitler was a changed man after being imprisoned?

[–] osanna@lemmy.vg 1 points 5 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

Look, just because he killed millions of Jews and the disabled and gays etc, doesn’t make him a bad person

- the NYT probably

[–] Fedizen@lemmy.world 2 points 14 hours ago

NYT has like articles from the 1850s being on the wrong side of history. Its tradition at this point.

[–] kSPvhmTOlwvMd7Y7E@lemmy.world 3 points 12 hours ago

Waging the war on words is one of the preferred liberals' passe-temps though lol on par with being offended

One of the dumbest hills to die on, with so many victimes

[–] LittleBorat3@lemmy.world 17 points 18 hours ago (1 children)

The evil black lesbians did this (and Biden).

[–] Mniot@programming.dev 7 points 18 hours ago

Whoah how did you type those words that are illegal to say? You must be so brave

[–] schema@lemmy.world 128 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (19 children)

The victim blaming is so disgusting. I heard people say shit like "Oh trans people asked for too much". Too much? Like what? Basic human rights? The right to exist?

They really think that if bullies get what they want they would just stop being bullies.

[–] criss_cross@lemmy.world 32 points 23 hours ago

Trans people wanted to play recreational sports and that was too much for some people to handle.

[–] LittleBorat3@lemmy.world 6 points 18 hours ago

I don't know if these people have encountered bullies on the playground

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[–] ryathal@sh.itjust.works 21 points 22 hours ago (15 children)

I did the thing. I read the transcript (it's a video chat/debate). Most of the woke they talk about hating is the older stuff that is super cringe or feels racist, like "person of color" or micro aggressions. It does cover that the anti-woke crowd is mostly about being openly racist/sexist or getting to say slurs.

The answer here seems to be leaning towards yes. The creations of labels that the people you were labeling didn't even like led to backlash, see Latinx or BIPOC. Coming up with euphemisms to justify removing white people from conferences or panels because there weren't minorities, instead of focusing on the opinions and thoughts represented. The woke crowd created problems that pushed people away that may have mostly agreed with them.

Ultimately it seems like you're opinion of woke and the definition you give it depends on when you became politically conscious. If it was in the 90e and early 2000s, it's a more negative view of the progressive definition of woke. If it was during the Obama years, you think it's more of a maga creation as a way to be more openly racist.

[–] RampantParanoia2365@lemmy.world 2 points 7 hours ago

I think it began to just mean being respectful of everyone, and aware of what's happening in the world--ie being awake. MAGA blew it up into some kind of militant identity

[–] socsa@piefed.social 9 points 17 hours ago (3 children)

The LatinX stuff is almost entirely manufactured agitprop, just like the CRT shit. Actual Hispanic people do sometimes use a soft "eh" instead of of a hard "o" or "a" for disambiguation and the latinX thing was more an observation and academic discussion of this than any real attempt at prescriptive language. Literally the only people who pushed that narrative were the ones trying to weaponize it.

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[–] BlameTheAntifa@lemmy.world 4 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Is the “woke crowd” in the room with us right now or have a few convenient fringe cases been cherry-picked to fit the fascist propaganda narrative?

Those who used woke as a pejorative never did so in good faith, it has always been overt racism.

[–] ryathal@sh.itjust.works 5 points 14 hours ago

There were plenty that used woke as a non perjorative term.

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world 4 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago) (3 children)

Woke is now a made up term. It no longer has a clear definition. It no longer has a consistent meaning. It does not "depend on when you became politically conscious." it depends on if you understand and recognize yellow journalism as a thought terminating practice rather than an intelligent one.

There is no debate here. The entire conversation in the article is based on a false perspective of history as determined by the propaganda written about it rather than true events.

This article might as well be titled, "Did Jews leave us worse off?"

Because it's literally written from the same falsely framed perspective as that statement is, and you unfortunately carried it further.

Specifically, from your summary:

"The woke crowd created problems that pushed people away that may have mostly agreed with them."

Is not a real thing that happened. This is history as perceived by its oppressors. You might as well be stating, "The Jews created problems that pushed people away that may have mostly agreed with them."

That problem Jews created? Existing. The problem "woke" created? Existing.

Same with "Illegal Immigrants." Same with "Trans" Same with every single marginalized group our current oligarchs can easily blame to shift the conversation away from them stealing your tax dollars through Reagonomics to start a international child sex trafficking network.

They're framing history as if the actions of these people and concepts are bad, despite the bad actions ONLY existing within the Propaganda they created.

Did trans people create bathroom problems that pushed people into passing bathroom laws and banning them? Or did they exist at a time there was a constant stream of propaganda saying they were?

Okay. Now ask yourself the same about "woke." Did they actually create problems? Or did their voices exist at a time when there was a constant stream of propaganda saying they were creating a problem?

That's why there's a negative shift in perspective between the 90's and 2000's. That's when Fox News and post 9-11 conservative propaganda started. There was no magical political awakening. It was when the fairness doctrine died and letting idiots on TV say the dumbest most un-American and unintelligent things imaginable became legal. Now to the point where propaganda is the primary perspective coming from nearly all our news channels, so we as a society can no longer easily determine what's real from what's a paid talking point.

So that's why Science is now questionable. Why our Education is now questionable. And the sustainability of our economy is now questionable.

Having intelligent discussions about all of those things was what "woke" started as. And our oligarchs hated that it always boiled down to them needing to pay more to improve them. So instead of paying for a country with better science, education, and a healthy economy, they paid to convince you all those things weren't needed, or were under attack by "woke" and that's why they were deteriorating.

So now we can't have a sincere discussion about politics without needing to first overcome the needlessly unintelligent shit people believe is real.

Like the concept that "woke" pushed anyone away instead of the manufactured propaganda around it that did. We're cooked if every political conversation needs to start with a discussion on whats real or paid propaganda, but here we are.

EDIT: Updated my opening statement to be more clear on my position and that there is indeed an actual real meaning to woke.

[–] BlameTheAntifa@lemmy.world 6 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Woke is a made up term. It has no definition. It has no consistent meaning.

There is a lot of good stuff in your comment, but this opening is extremely problematic. Woke was created in the 1930s with a clear intended definition, which was re-codified in court by DeSantis’ own fascist lawyers.

“The belief there are systemic injustices in America, and the need to address them.”

That is it. Anyone who uses a completely different definition — especially as a pejorative — is simply a racist, bigoted nazi slur. It’s as simple as that.

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world 4 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Woke was created in the 1930s with a clear intended definition, which was re-codified in court by DeSantis’ own fascist lawyers.

100% agree with this statement. I do not agree with the current definition from DeSantis' fascist lawyers and failed to make that clear in my opening.

I SHOULD have described the word as follows instead:

Woke is NOW a made up term. It has no CLEAR definition anymore. It NOW has no consistent meaning.

That's much more clear for what I was going for, so apologies for the confusion!

[–] osanna@lemmy.vg 2 points 5 hours ago

Wut. You’re supposed to call each other slurs and insult the other’s mother. What is this, amateur hour??

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[–] Jay101@lemmy.world 2 points 13 hours ago

Iranian propaganda is making better and more informative content than NYT

[–] Fedizen@lemmy.world 2 points 14 hours ago

NYT's job has always been to protect bullies and attack decent people.

[–] frazw@lemmy.world 77 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Anti-wokeness can be directly tied to many of society's current problems. So maybe that means the answer is an indirect "yes"?

I mean if people are going to go around thinking and empathizing with others we wouldn't be able to bomb the middle East every 20 years, would we?

[–] LittleBorat3@lemmy.world 9 points 18 hours ago

But wokeness is something they made up to be a big problem so they could tear it down.

People still don't understand this was an artificially inflated debate.

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