This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
I wonder how much of this is about cracking down on Newpipe, ReVanced and other unauthorized clients.
My suspicion is that it's because the playstore has become so awful that google is seeing the effect in their earnings. If customers get burned one too many times on a crappy app with fake reviews, then they're not going to spend any money on anything else in the store anymore. So now Google tries to sabotage the possible alternatives, rather than try to fix their product.
Playstore got so unbelievably bad now, and it happened so quickly, I feel like I'm going insane. Who's decision was to do it like that and was there even a person to make decisions!
I have actually bought an app on the play store once, because I had a gift card. Turns out, they didn't use the gift card and used my cc on file for Google drive. Had to spend hours sorting that out with automated customer service, never gonna use that again. Their product actually does suck, and a lot of the reason that f-droid doesn't is that they aren't charging you to use it.
Ordered a Jolla phone with their SailfishOs (linux based). Time to leave android
Isn't SailfishOS proprietary?
SailfishOS is heavily closed source and Jolla used to be linked to Russia with Rostelecom owning 60%+ of it.
Some of the OS is proprietary especially the android layer, the rest is open source which is based on linux Meego owned by Nokia. I believe quite a few of the Nokia guys went further into developing Sailfish Os. I find the Russian link ( also Votron) also a bit crap. But i dont like the heavy dependence of Google either...
Someone needs to bring back Symbian OS
I miss my old Nokia sometimes
Would these work outside of Europe, say in the U.S. or Canada?
They will work outside of Europe according to their website. Also it says on the website:
The initial sales markets are EU, UK, Switzerland and Norway. Entering other markets, such as the U.S. and Canada are to be decided due course based on potential interest from the areas.
We will design the cellular band configuration to enable potential future markets, including major U.S. carrier networks.
Possibly at a base level, but not well. Most US carriers have a white list of devices certified to use their networks.
does VoLTE work? Basically all carriers in the us use this and we knocked down all of the old tech towers. My understanding is the EU still has all the old towers up for just voice calls and don't need VoLTE to work.
Quick web search suggests it is a "beta" feature at best currently :(
In the EU VoLTE seems to work with most providers but there are issues with some providers. I think the sailfish OS forum has a compatibility list. Not sure how the situation is in the US as, this does depend on providers.
I'm curious, how does this affect EU users? Isn't this against our rules?
It's trying to squeeze through a legal loophole. They have to allow apps from outside their appstore. But law does not explicitly say they can't require them to be verified by google first.
So get a phone that can run AOSP and its many child roms and dont give a damn. Literally whole point of Android.
Now that US market has long since abandoned locking you into a contract for 2 years in exchange for a free flagship, and locking bootloaders on US models on top of that - just export whatever you want and magisk/aosp it.
This new limit is literally made for the savvy public who uses external apks and such and not the vast majority of room temperature IQs anyway.
Nobody (for now),/as it can be easil, bypassed
I can't see this move by Google as anything but a power grab to reduce competition. If someone wants to bear the "risk" of installing software that hasn't been vetted by Google, why does Google insist on being a nanny that makes it more difficult? Money, that's why. Google is acting to try to enforce its monopoly over android apps. GrapheneOS, which is more secure than android, doesn't make a fuss over this issue. No, this is only an issue with the company that hoovers up all your data in breach of your privacy.
I can’t see this move by Google as anything but a power grab to reduce competition
It locks down phones. Without sideloading the elite controls which messenger services can be used. They most likely can also secretly update apps and replace them with versions that leak the encryption keys.
With Google not being threatened by a competitor this essentially tells us that the elite is serious about moving to fascism.
It's frightening to me that the comment has 85 upvotes but no reply that points this out.
Ironically, this may be a catalyst for better Linux Phones
It took 6-10 years for Android to take shape.
On Linux, every app has full access to your browsing history, clipboard (passwords), photos with geo-tags, music, list of other installed apps, contacts. Unrestricted battery and network access -- it's a tracking paradise. And all it takes is one supply chain attack on npm install with typical 4000K dependency packages
Thats why flatpaks exist for those kind of apps and sandboxes are very much possible on linux (even if not widely used for normal programs)
Flatpack is only a piece of the puzzle. I remember in early Android version, an app could increas gyroscope query frequency (i.e. a racing game demanding precise phone tilt), then crash and the gyroscope would drain battery within hours. And again — this is only one example.
The ecosystem must grow — to this day, I cannot set Immich as my default gallery app on LineageOS. So I take a photo, and can't immediatelly look at it. And Android is already mature. There must be a standard and secure way of exchanging calendar events, notes, photos. Developers must adopt this new ecosystem — it takes years.
The best option we have right now is to pressure Google to allow alternative to Play Services and also sponsor AOSP development outside of Google. There are numerous Linux distros, including commercial ones, I don't see why we can't have numerous Android flavors.
Honestly I would much rather long term have decent Linux for phones, as AOSP derived programs will always rely in some way on google code. I would prefer having one large FOSS Linux ecosystem
From the pure technical standpoint, AOSP is better in every way. Fully managed runtime gives better control over resources scheduling, better app sandboxing. Battery life. Uniform hardware support.
All obstacles for it to be open were artificially made by lawyers.
Like Jolla runs Android emulation layer. Same Android but without its benefits.
Linux phones have already been around for many years. Right now we're very close to Linux phones that are usable on a daily basis. Not as close to decent Linux phones, of course, but with the right (not at all unrealistic) resources it could be completely within reach in a year or two.
Also, Flatpaks exist and work pretty much just like Android apps.
I made a full comment in this thread. The bottomline is
It all takes years.
Linux phones are around for enthusiasts since Nokia N900 (which was/is a masterpiece) — yet nothing is remotely close to a mainstream phone.
When I hear 'mainstream phone', in my mind I picture an iPhone or a Samsung. So yeah, Linux phones are definitely not achieving that this decade. Though personally I don't think they necessarily need to, at all.
Point 4 is probably not happening any time soon, if ever, either. Rest is slowly being done and progressing, so I'm not seeing any major problems there.
I don't think anyone realistically expects a Linux phone to compete with an iPhone in terms of ease of use, quality of life features or UI/UX. As far as I've seen, people just want a decent phone with basic functionalities like long battery life, good camera, easy to use and smooth UI, maps and navigation. All while being more private and secure, of course.
Mainstream phone as in "I don't need to debug it via terminal"
The issue I'm pointing at: safe, long battery life, snappy maps while driving is what took AOSP more than 5 years.
It would be very unfortunate to discard all that work and start from scratch.
Thank god I run /e/OS. I just hope this won't hurt the popularity of sideloaded apps too much, as this might mean FOSS apps becoming stagnant because they don't receive as much attention anymore
I also use /e/OS. I'm not too versed in these things, but if I understand correctly from your comment, this decision by Google won't directly affect us right? Only in the sense that it discourages developers to not support FOSS apps?
Yeah, it won't affect you really. /e/OS is based off of AOSP and Lineage and the devs can just choose to keep it like it currently is. I haven't really found a source for it but since theres like no official play store, and the lineage community would just patch out whatever google introduces (If this even reaches AOSP) I don't think this will ever bother neither of us. The real threat comes from FOSS projects dying bc most Android users still use proprietary android
Alright, thanks for the confirmation! Yeah, hopefully this won't affect FOSS projects too much...
This is my #1 concern with this bullshit.
I only hope that manufacturers respond to this kind of behavior. Motorola deserves full credit for adopting grapheneos. I think some of the Chinese manufacturers have their own forks too?
How? The TOS for selling phones with Google services is that they can't sell phones with an Android fork outside China. Even the ODM is affected, meaning nobody will ever think this.
I saw in Italy that selling phones without Google services is a death sentence, Huawei crashed from 25% marketshare to 0% basically overnight even if they already had a "plan B" where they made "new" phones using the same specs and codename but in a different shape to buy time and when they launched their fork they had a 1:1 replacement for GMS called HMS so devs could still embed Google Maps and it will be replaced automatically by petal maps. Devs could upload their apps with a single click and users could install Google services unofficially installing an "unofficial 😉" APK with all the right signatures. Nobody did that. One click = too much work = nobody touches the default
At least they can leave the bootloader unlockable for us, but fucking Xiaomi really needs to make 200 new fucking models a year with lots of proprietary bits and abandons them after 6 months so it's impossibile for the community to make a well supported custom ROM. They copy everything from apple except the part where they should only make 4 fucking models a year. Basic, standard, pro and pro max. Don't need a "Xiaomi Redmi note 29T pro 5G wideband edition"
