this post was submitted on 17 Oct 2023
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Linux Gaming

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Discussions and news about gaming on the GNU/Linux family of operating systems (including the Steam Deck). Potentially a $HOME away from home for disgruntled /r/linux_gaming denizens of the redditarian demesne.

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[–] tabular@lemmy.world 82 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Talk is cheap. It's been "planned" for Tarkov since before I started using Linux.

[–] Sylvartas@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Tbf most devs probably want to do it, they just can't justify it financially. Most games' programmers are computer nerds, and they would be the ones in charge of implementing that kind of stuff. They'd happily do it because obviously, as computer nerds they love Linux, but even if they accept to do some unpaid overtime just because they really want to implement this, it might get blocked by the publisher because they don't want that kind of stuff to bypass QA especially since it has a chance of affecting all users, and when looking at the numbers, it's just not profitable to them.

Now the steam deck could change that dynamic because it has a decent market share, and I would love to see the actual numbers but I'd be willing to bet that most deck owners buy more games than the average player.

Source: am games' programmer, computer nerd, and steam deck owner

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[–] savvywolf@pawb.social 74 points 2 years ago (3 children)

I want to be optimistic, bit honestly this to me reads like the non-commital "thanks for your concern, we'll look into it" consumer service style non-answer.

I hope it ends up somewhere, but I can also see it remaining in their ticketing system for eternity.

[–] moody@lemmings.world 8 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I think the Steam Deck is a platform that devs are aware of, and I'm sure they don't want to alienate that segment of their sales. They also want to avoid negative reviews.BattlEye is also supported in other games on Linux, including native versions, so it shouldn't be a big deal to ensure its functionality.

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[–] KpntAutismus@lemmy.world 40 points 2 years ago (1 children)

the year of me being able to run literally any game on linux is fast approaching.

[–] Dark_Arc@social.packetloss.gg 31 points 2 years ago

Some places do eventually listen. Crytek stealth dropped easy anticheat support for Hunt Showdown a few versions ago.

[–] Olmai@lemmy.world 24 points 2 years ago

I think we can thank the steam deck for that

[–] Astaroth@lemm.ee 19 points 2 years ago
[–] Excrubulent@slrpnk.net 19 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I am genuinely curious how anti-cheat works on an open source OS. I don't know a whole lot about how it works to be honest, but is there no problem with cheaters being able to manipulate the entire stack down to the kernel level?

Like I'm aware cheaters can decompile code so closed source isn't necessarily that much better. Did I just answer my own question or is there more to it?

[–] chaorace@lemmy.sdf.org 16 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I'll do my best to explain:

Firstly, not all code executed on an open source OS needs to be open source. For example: Epic Anti-Cheat, which comes with a Linux-compatible mode, is fully closed source. So right off the bat we're going to put to bed the notion that somehow the platform of choice makes it easier for bad actors to pull apart and examine anticheat software.

Secondly, yes, there is a problem with cheaters being able to hide from anticheats on Linux. This is because on Windows it's relatively easy to run kernel-level code via drivers -- this is why most anticheats require admin permission to install a monitoring driver before the game will run. The anticheat is effectively rootkitting your system in order to circumvent other rootkits that may be concealing epic cheatz.

On GNU/Linux, almost all device drivers come prepackaged in the Linux kernel, so there's no direct equivalent to the Windows approach of allowing users to install third-party code into the most protected rings of the OS. It's still possible through the use of kernel modules (see NVIDIA drivers), but as evidenced by how annoying it is to use NVIDIA devices on Linux, this is a huge PITA for both the developer & the user to deal with.

So that's the rub. On Linux, anticheats just have to trust that the kernel isn't lying. This has been a perpetual thorn in the side of developers like Google, who'd really really like it if they could prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that a given Android device is not rooted (see SafetyNet). Google's solution to this has been to introduce hardware-backed attestation -- basically a special hardware chip on the device that can prove that the kernel software has not been tainted in any way.

[–] uis@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

This is because on Windows it's relatively easy to run kernel-level code via drivers

Buuut there is nothing stopping a person from using virtualization.

[–] BURN@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

There’s generally other checks around virtualization. Both VMs and even dedicated KVMs result in triggering the AC generally

[–] uis@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

AC somehow aren't triggered when virtualization is disabled in bios.

Alternatively binary translation or custom processors.

EDIT: there are some public info suggesting that most of detection caused by misconfiguration.

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[–] uis@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I am geniunely curious how anti-cheat works on an PC with physical access, where user can plug their mouse loaded with cheats.

For every malware anti-cheat there will be sandboxing cheat.

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[–] TigrisMorte@kbin.social 18 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Perhaps don't rely upon client side to do all the heavy lifting and problem solved without having to install malware?

[–] pineapplelover@lemm.ee 3 points 2 years ago (5 children)

I've seen this argument pop up but I'm confused with technical details on how it would work. Wouldn't the client still need to download the game? Modifying the game files is a vector for attack. If it's fully online on their servers then it would be pretty slow wouldn't it?

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[–] Rayspekt@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Is this finally the beginning of anti-cheat games coming to linux? I'd love official ports for stuff like League or Honkai Star Rail.

[–] Phanatik@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

League of Legends does work but it's painful. I use an AUR package called leagueoflegends-git which was the only way I could get it to work on my setup.

https://leagueoflinux.org/ has been invaluable. It used to be a subreddit but it's been made private since the API debacle.

[–] Linus_Torvalds@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I disagree on the painful part. The lutris install is basically 1-click.

[–] Phanatik@kbin.social 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Well, painful for me. I tried Lutris, Bottles and native Wine and none worked. I played around with wine-lol for a bit too but the AUR package was the one that got it working.

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[–] ElectroLisa@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Honkai unofficially works on Linux, but it requires bypassing the anti-cheat, there are a few methods to do so

[–] Rayspekt@kbin.social 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Bypassing the anti-cheat will get you banned if it gets detected, wouldn't it?

[–] ElectroLisa@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 years ago

Yes, there was one ban wave for Honkai Star Rail, but Genshin and Honkai Impact didn't have any over a while

[–] TheCheddarCheese@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago (2 children)

why do so many anticheats not allow linux?

[–] SeekPie@lemmy.world 20 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

What I've heard is that they don't think that it's a big enough market to have to fix bugs that might happen only on linux and such, so they just don't allow us to play.

[–] sanpo@sopuli.xyz 14 points 2 years ago (6 children)

It'd be nice, but from what I see most devs against this suggest Linux gamers are a bunch of dirty hackers and it's somehow much easier to cheat there.

They just conveniently forget that Valve offered to fix any bugs themselves that are specific to Linux/Proton...

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[–] calzone_gigante@lemmy.eco.br 2 points 2 years ago

Some require kernel level access, which is a big security risk.

[–] raubarno@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That profile pic looks cool, though

[–] ElectroLisa@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 2 years ago

Thanks, it's a modified VRChat avatar called Rindo

[–] Tywele@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 years ago

I didn't expect the dev to be Nexon

[–] luky 2 points 2 years ago

this is awesome. i like this dev. i give it 5 more years to expext most games and graphics drivers work with an easy setup

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