Have you read the Bible? The only evil shit that Satan does is when he fucks up Job's life, and that's in collusion with God. Meanwhile, God is doing evil on almost every page of the Old Testament.

The reason we're supposed to hate Satan is because he rebelled against God. Again, if you've read the Old Testament, you have dozens of good reasons to rebel against God.

This train of thought is what lead to the creation of Satanism as a literary movement in the 19th century and then as a religion in the late 20th century.

The bible is just mythology.

In the beginning man created god. In the end we'll either correct the mistake, or it will be our extinction.

Lucifer was just unionizing the angels. God is just the first union buster and ran a smear campaign against the organizer.

The only way Christianity makes any sense to me within the real world (aside from it being not real) is if Satan wrote the Bible pretending to be God, while denigrating the good guy as the rebellious angel Lucifer. If Satan had written the Bible instead of God, would you expect more genocide, slavery, torture, and rape, or less? So why is there any in the first place?

Look at 2000 years of Christian history. As soon as they could, they usurped political power in the most powerful nation in the area; Rome. Then began slaughtering and torturing anyone anywhere who thought different. They claimed divine rights and authority. They committed genocide in every single nation on the planet over nearly 2000 years. They perfected the dark arts of torture. They conquered earthly territory and plundered earthly wealth. They slaughtered so many that they built orphanages the world over where they could claim divine morality, but also rape children for centuries.

What did Lucifer do exactly? He told the first people that God was a lying dick and they should rebel against him, as he did.

Wouldn't you?

I felt this way coming from the Midwest to down south. There are plenty of biggots west of the missippi too but folks like the west borrow morons are rare. Down south id hear biggots on the goddamn radio.

At least for the most part, as an outsider, Midwest churches were mostly just seen doing charities (like that's all Jesus asked them do for others...).

I think about this all the time. He probably just believes in science and kindness.

Since he's the one driving them, you can't wonder too much

Anne Rice wrote an interesting book in the Vampire series on this, Memnoch the Devil, where the narrative is that Satan created a place for the souls to go that God otherwise would have extinguished in his cold hatred for much of humanity. Satan, who loved humans more than any other angel, rebelled against God's harsh treatment of them, and was cast down as a result.

I mean the guy actually met God and decided to rebel. Meanwhile, we have to believe without evidence and assume he knows best. Sure, buddy, sure

I like Satan because he brings presents to kids on Christmas made by elves in the North Pole, in exchange for some cookies and a kiss from Mom

"I have no special regard for Satan; but I can at least claim that I have no prejudice against him. It may even be that I lean a little his way, on account of his not having a fair show. All religions issue bibles against him, and say the most injurious things about him, but we never hear his side." - Mark Twain

You don't have to look at Christians to think God isn't so good.

In the Bible, Satan kills 10 people, Job's children, and he did it with God's blessing while they were having a bet.

God killed entire cities, all the firstborn of a nation even down to the slave's children, killed everyone on earth except 8 people, killed a guy for picking up sticks, killed a guy for not allowing the ark of the covenant to fall, told the Hebrews to attack nations and kill every man woman and child in the land and was furious when they left a few alive, had a God-off to show he was more powerful and when the other side converted to believe in him he had them killed, killed David's son and had his 10 wives publicly raped, killed 42 children for making fun of a bald guy... the list goes on, not to mention that God told the Hebrews to have slave's, women were property and have to be killed if they ruin the one thing they were good for, their virginity.

Christians have weirdest relationship with the Bible. Many don't really read it. If they did, they'd be Jewish. Jesus said to keep the Jewish laws, but Paul said it's ok not to. Christians go with Paul instead of Jesus and generally disregard the Old Testament except the parts they think prove Jesus was the Messiah.

You can call yourself anything you want, and no one will stop you. Calling yourself a Christian, while violating every tenet of Christian teachings, does not qualify you as a Christian. I finally coined the term Hypochrists for people like that.

There are plenty of Christians who do follow Christian teachings, to one extent or another, and are generally trying to be decent people. Unfortunately, there are also large numbers of "Christians" who just use the name to justify their selfish behavior, hatred, and cruelty.

All large religions have, or have had, groups like that. Any social institution that can provide credibility is going to be abused as a tool to gain power by someone. It is appalling that the Hypochrists have become large enough, and powerful enough, to have taken over the popular image of what Christianity is.

Isn't this the theme of WICKED? The "good" people are wicked and the "wicked" people are good. Of course, anyone who has done DMT knows that the insectoid creatures, machine elves, aliens, angels, clowns, snakes and green lady are all good which does make you wonder if we have it all backward.

Popular Christianity is heavily based on paganism, which is incredibly ironic considering that paganism is generally posed as the antithesis of Christianity. The story of Lucifer is syncretized with the story of Prometheus, although Lucifer doesn't really benefit humanity at all. According to the popular interpretation, Lucifer is the origin of all evil, became a snake in the garden of Eden, and then tempted Eve to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. However, the snake isn't actually connected to Lucifer in the text—that interpretation was added later to explain the problem of evil (why it exists if God is supposedly good)

The idea that Lucifer is insubordinate and violated the natural hierarchy is very old, but the idea that Lucifer is the origin of evil is relatively new.

Christian theology contains many holes like this because there's a tendency towards treating every word in the Bible as literal, where it may have been written allegorically or as a parable, as Jesus often did. (Just to be clear, Jesus did NOT write the Bible, I'm just pointing out that the writers of the Bible may have tried to replicate his style.) This issue is compounded when you include the Old testament, as it contains portions which are clearly mythological, but are nonetheless treated as fact by certain modern Christians.

Dat Demiurge be at it again

The concept of good and evil is actually very limiting and tends to raise people with twisted worldviews. Most intelligent people learn that morality is complex, reality is not black and white, and to wish harm upon others to ensure personal bliss is rather sociopathic and fucked up.

Christianity faces a major foundational dissonance. Early tribalist (in group, out group thinking) values that have to coexist with radical empathic universalism. They usually ignore the development of Jewish traditions, and it took priests centuries of dissertation to mesh both views together. But they are incompatible. To believe in clearcut good and evil, and also things like a reward heaven (an idea also eradicated in most Jewish tradition). One must learn to suspend empathy for the fellow human being. To be happy while knowing others are harshly suffering (aka "they deserve it"). To think that one's own cruelty will be forgiven just by saying a magical incantation is also fucked up.

Now, the solution given to it is not widely accepted, and is the source of schisms in different Christian cults. Jesus's message is that of universal forgiveness with radical empathy. The abolition of heaven and hell. But many intermediate concepts had to be inserted to make it make sense with organized religion. Like sin forgivenes through repentance, second coming prophecies to delay the forgivines, apocalyptic prophecies to delay the abolition of hell and other exceptionalist interpretations.

Anyways, I started rambling, but Christianity is incapable to be internally consistent as it is. And some dogmatic views require people to be actively assholes by definition.

I think if a being like lucifer exist and is truly evil then it has tricked these 'christians' in to worshiping it instead of the god.

Being Christian or going to church doesn't make you a good person any more than a speed limit sign prevents people from speeding.

As a man who works in retail, Lucifer was an employee who thought he deserved a raise, and maybe even take over as manager one day, but the current manager didn't like that so he sent Lucy to burn at the customer service desk (hell) for eternity.

Lucifer's crime was daring to question his father.

After being cast out he was put in charge of overseeing those that were deemed by that same father to be bad after death.

Seems to be a common link there, and it's not Lucifer.

I feel like many Christians in America are completely disconnected from actual values espoused by Jesus in the Bible. Republican (many of the Christians) policy is diametrically opposed to Matthew 25:31. No one quotes John 13:34 because they rather quote Old Testament BS about what’s an abomination. Why not focus on the love for others, including enemies? Why not focus on helping the poor, the sick, the homeless? Why not help the immigrant? The Bible specifically calls this out as a marker of getting into heaven.

Most of these people don’t even read the book. They like the sense of community at a church, but it feels like it’s formed into a total in:out group mentality. We can’t be a Christian nation as long as there are poor & people struggling.

Then the Utah governor says something like, “We can’t have people camping wherever they want.” my emphasis. Bud, they don’t WANT to be homeless. The lack of empathy is so apparent.