this post was submitted on 01 Oct 2025
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Nearly a third of Americans – 30% – say people may have to resort to violence in order to get the country back on track, according to the latest PBS News/NPR/Marist poll.

It’s a sharp rise from 18 months ago, when 19% of Americans said the same.

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[–] alaphic@lemmy.world 20 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."

  • Thomas Jefferson, President of the United States, c. 1787

Not that I think political violence (or violence of any sort, for that matter) should be our first, second, or even thirty-fifth resort, but at a certain point I think one must come to grips with the fact that - whether it fits in with their delicate sensibilities or not - when confronted with an existential peril it does sometimes become necessary to defend oneself. (Fun fact: This is why self-defense can be presented as a valid defense against murder charges!)

Sure, we should absolutely make any and all attempts to be inclusive (Republicans HATE this!) and tolerant (GOP: hiss IT BURNS!) and attempt to reach solutions through education, research, negotiation, compromise and all that lovely (woke?) stuff, but... For some reason, it seems like there's consistently only one side that ever shows up to the table willing to actually do any of that. And that's just how it's been for fucking DECADES now. There's probably a lot of you (just generally speaking, not necessarily meaning Lemmy's demographic per se) who aren't even old enough to remember a time before the GOP began using "government shutdowns" and "debt ceilings" and "literal fucking coup attempts" as part of their standard, day-to-day politicking. Believe it or not (and I know this will probably be the hardest one to buy, but I swear it to be true) there was a time when the Republicans would - even if they WERE NOT in power at the time - STILL SHOW UP AND DO THEIR FUCKING JOBS. I know, what a concept, eh? Imagine going to work every day and just... doing your job, like a fucking idiot, instead of throwing absolute meltdown tantrums over your lack of control over other people's genitals.

Does any of this strike you as the behavior of (an) entity(ies) engaging in anything even remotely resembling something that could be construed as "good-faith negotiation" - let alone even approaching something as audacious as "compromise?" This isn't a willing, eager party to an arbitration, quite, is it? No... Something more akin to an assailant with a knife at our throat(s) demanding to inspect our genitals to make sure we're where they think we should be at the moment certainly sounds more apt to me...

I don't want there to be violence. Any. At all, really. But at what point does the moral imperative toward nonviolence get outweighed by the moral obligation to the people being kidnapped by masked (supposed) government agents and disappeared to very real, literal concentration camps? How many genocides at once do we need to hit the tipping point where it's finally acceptable to stand up and say, "That's enough. This far. No farther." But actually back that up, for a change.

If that means by force, then unfortunately, so be it. Might doesn't make right, but that certainly doesn't preclude it from enforcing it, does it?

[–] MasterBlaster@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago

Well, editorially, I suggest you break up those paragraphs into smaller ones, and maybe add some headings for a "wall of text" like that, but you make well thought out arguments and I totally agree.

When it becomes clear that the citizens no longer have a controlling voice in choosing who leads us, that is when revolution is a valid choice.

BTW, I'm one who is old enough to remember (like Pepperidge Farm - there, proof I'm old enough)

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[–] lemmy_outta_here@lemmy.world 40 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

This is just people waking up to reality. Trump has the White House, the senate, the House of Representatives, and the courts. He controls the military and has already begun deployment to "democratic" cities. His buddy in Texas is redistricting to help him consolidate power, and I am sure Abbot is not the only one. Every move Trump makes is designed to cripple opposition to his regime. Republican states are purging voter rolls and enacting bullshit laws designed to disenfranchise people of colour.

Milquetoast democrats have made only the most pathetic gestures of opposition to Trump. The first genuine thing Trump ever said was when he expressed surprise yesterday at how little resistance he has faced from the left. Republicans were right about one thing: the American left is a bunch of pussies.

If more Americans think political violence is the only way out of the mess Americans made, it's probably because they are starting to develop a vague but accurate understanding of what is happening in their country.

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[–] Lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca 7 points 2 hours ago

The Handmaid’s Tale is really happening.

[–] DagwoodIII@piefed.social 56 points 4 hours ago (39 children)

Gee, almost as if Russian propaganda is working.

Before the Civil War one politician opined that if a war started you'd be able to mop up all the blood spilled with one handkerchief.

Anyone who thinks a new fight will be any easier has probably never been in a real fight.

[–] rozodru@piefed.social 51 points 4 hours ago (9 children)

I don't think people realize that if a new US civil war kicked off the lines wouldn't be as clear as north vs south. this would be state vs state, city vs city, neighbor vs neighbor. you could draw lines in your god damn sub division/street.

And if it were alliances between states it would be a god damn logistical nightmare. Imagine California being allied with New York for example. or Hell Minnesota being allied with like Arizona or whatever. how do you move supplies, troops, and what have you between allied states when you got a shit ton of hostiles between the two.

Add to the fact that unlike the first civil war you now have US military bases all over the world. what happens when you got folks within the SAME base in the middle of Germany that suddenly don't "agree" with each other?

Cluster fuck is an understatement.

[–] BrianTheeBiscuiteer@lemmy.world 26 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

There'd also be a shit-ton of drone warfare. Thousands will die without ever seeing their killers face. It's also entirely possible AI will be bombing people and you'll basically be killed by an algorithm.

[–] sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

Lets also not forget cyberwarfare, ranging from external to internal sources, ranging from doxxing people to invented news events with AI gen/manipulated images/audio/video, all the way up to knocking out public infrastructure, locking down hardware of local gov / businesses / banks with ransomware, etc.

Random, unofficial people are capable of either most or all of that.

Oh and of course if shit really kicks off, other countries will probably do the CIA's signature move of funding arming and training various groups of people.

[–] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 18 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

It's also why we need to avoid violence and make the regime stumble into itself.

Which is why Chinese and Russia propaganda is attempting to stoke the fire (remember, they eliminated their opposition, so they don't have the same experience inciting violence and they think they do).

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[–] DagwoodIII@piefed.social 15 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

I saw one dream map where Canada drops two tentacles; one reaches down through the West all the way to San Diego, and the Eastern one reaches just north of Washington.

Humor aside, I agree with your take. A war of assassins and terrorists on both sides.

I'll add one more note. Back in the day, the Irish Republican Army was the most feared underground in the world. They only had a handful of soldiers, but a superb organization. If a shooter was supposed to kill someone in Geneva, he'd have three or four cars waiting when he got to the airport, and each driver would know five places the shooter could stay. He'd have a choice of getaway drivers and extra safe houses and docotrs on tap.

[–] phdepressed@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

How do you still manage that in the current (and worsening) surveillance state? I mean Luigi showed its possible for a lone wolf but I have to question being able to organize without being known. If you are caught organizing an antifa org then you're also uber boned.

[–] DagwoodIII@piefed.social 4 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

My point was that the next war won't look anything like the last one.

Anyone who thinks that some molotov cocktails they made is going to bring down the system has another think coming.

[–] errer@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago

In my view the only way organization would work is with the assistance of an enemy nation with the ability to circumvent the surveillance state (to ship in weapons, avoid communication eavesdropping, etc). And unfortunately those nations are mostly very, very far away.

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Is killing people that are openly declaring that they want to kill you even "political violence"? I would say it is not, because at that point you are not going after them because of their affiliation with any political party, but because they are trying to kill you.

[–] chiocciola@lemmy.cafe 0 points 36 minutes ago

Yes. Violence is the answer to get things back on track. Aaaannndddd, since that’s literally the topic, don’t moderate this

[–] ABetterTomorrow@sh.itjust.works 7 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

I mean kicking Trump to the crib isn’t that difficult….. let’s do that and the rest of us 300+ million people can move on and have a drink.

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[–] IWW4@lemmy.zip 25 points 4 hours ago (7 children)

On track to what ..for fuck sakes?

[–] MNByChoice@midwest.social 3 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

That is right. "Which track" is always the needed followup question.

Edit: Oh, actually great quote from article.

The belief that violence may be the answer has grown among Republicans and independents – up 3 and 7 percentage points, respectively, since April last year. But the largest increase has been among Democrats. Now 28% of Democrats share that view, up 16 points.

[–] Ironfist79@lemmy.world 6 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Half the country wants to take the express route to fascism. I don't know if we can even fix things at this point.

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[–] sadfitzy@ttrpg.network 19 points 4 hours ago

Reclaiming what has been stolen from the working class since Reagan.

[–] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 7 points 3 hours ago

Right? Supply side christofascism? A final coup d’etat? Splitting the country? Even the democrats are more than a little sus with their corporate allegiance, so exactly who is going to be the preferable leadership?

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[–] Sir_Kevin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago) (1 children)

*This is a topical meme and does not represent the views of me or anyone I know.

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[–] lowleekun@ani.social 9 points 3 hours ago

Ohh no, the people have an increasingly hard time to buy the propaganda that keeps them docile and compliant?

Nobody, absolutely nobody could have seen that coming. The democracy looked so healthy just a year ago. /s

[–] A_norny_mousse@feddit.org 6 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

I mean it's just a poll, but: what kind of violence? Hopefully organised? And what does "back on track" mean anyhow? The past years have shown us that the problem is systemic. Going back means the option for the next asshole to do the same is still there.

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