Just use the device mobile security researchers use.
You’re gonna hate it when you discover which one it is.
this post was submitted on 29 Sep 2025
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The fact that there are only two operating systems and both are locked down is a major problem. Unless a company like Valve invests heavily in a linux phone it is unlikely to ever go mainstream enough for developer or device support.
We need governments and legislators to force these systems open. To enshrine the right to control the things you own and criminalize any attempt to curb people’s ownership or control. That is the first step. Once that’s in place, the environment for a third option to exist will be in place.
Without defending one or the other, as long as you have proprietary closed software running on the device itself or on the backend of the services it syncs with, all you can have is assumptions and reasonable doubt about how the data is used. We're trading convenience for someone knowing something about us.
Yeah, you can go with a Linux phone but forget about:
- controlling any IOT device
- using any smart watch/sport trakcer
- Android Auto or any remote car features
- mobile banking
- authenticating at work
- buying public transport tickets from your phone
- using apps for boarding pass when flying
- charging your car at most public chargers
- using any type of digital ID or documents
If you're already a luddite that's awesome, you're free to move to Linux phones. If you like modern tech and the convenience it gave us it will be really fucking sad to lose all of it because or corporate greed.
Agreed, but is a chicken and egg problem. People won't use Linux because the apps they want don't support it and apps won't support it because most people don't use Linux. Someone will have to cave in if we want to break this stupid proprietary duopoly.
Someone will have to cave in if we want to break this stupid proprietary duopoly.
Honestly that's not a chicken-and-egg problem. Only one party of the two in this example has the power to create or change apps, whereas people in this example, even if they would use Linux, they effectively are prevented from.
The "someone" who has to cave in is obvious.
The best way is freeing Android. Android should be the "Mobile Linux". What should happen is that EU should ensure that people are allowed to side load and unlock bootloaders and that all apps are compatible with alternative ROMs. All dependencies on google play services should simply be made illegal and all apps should be fully compatible with AOSP.
If we can't get this we will spend the next 10-15 years in mobile dark ages. Mobile Linux may never get enough tracking to be supported the way desktop Linux is.
I don’t think it’ll play out that way. Manufacturers aren’t going to ditch Google. Play Store and Google certification are too valuable for them. And for small developers, most of them rely on Google’s infrastructure. If the EU decides to take that away, only big players with resources could handle their own systems, which ironically makes things less open because indies get squeezed out.
If we skip the Play Services part, the EU might push for sideloading and more openness, but realistically Play Services will remain dominant simply because it’s the easiest and most convenient option for developers. So we’ll probably end up with a halfway solution: technically more open, but practically still dependent on Google.
If we really want change, proper GNU/Linux phones need to catch up or at least run Android apps (APKs) reliably. That alone would solve 70% of the problem. The remaining 30% comes down to infrastructure and right now Google Play Services is just too polished and convenient (especially for indies who don’t care about FOSS ideals) for devs to walk away from.
Manufacturers aren’t going to ditch Google. Play Store and Google certification are too valuable for them.
If legislation is made such that eg.: in the EU phones can not be registered in the cellular network unless they are open to both normal installation of apps (sIdElOaDiNg) and being able to fully install or remove Google Services, then Google will have to deal with who would want to work and pay to get a certification that effectively blocks you from selling and operating in one or more continents.
And such legislation would be not without precedent: open phones and custom ROMs are already suffering from it.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
I will admit I'm ignorant here. What do companies use Google Play Services for? I developed some Android app and I never had to rely on Google. I just used F-Droid. Other than play store for distribution, which services provided by Google would be so hard to replace?
Location services, geofencing, connectivity sign in, banking services... basically the walls of the garden
I used to run an LTE-enabled nettop instead of a phone during the app-only craze, can't get any worse than that. Recently removed bank apps, taxi, delivery, maps, youtube, email and all social media apps off my phone in favour of using websites instead. They're still a bit of an afterthought compared to apps so the experience is a bit clunky, but the option is available for most things nowadays.
Some things yes. I don't have any social media apps (not even lemmy) or YT but my car charger requires an app, my AC has an app I use from time to time, my Garmin GPS has an app, I have to use MS Authenticator at work, my car has an app and Android Auto and 90% of public car charges require an app. None of this has website alternative. Can I live without them? Well, not without work obviously and where I live electric car infrastructure is so tied to mobile phones I'm seriously considering just giving up and going back to a normal car.
Don't they have functioning Android app support now?
In theory yes but most non open source apps require google play services. Hard to tell how long those will work with waydroid and similar. Also running android apps this ways destroys battery apparently.
Most of this i don't use my phone for anyway. I'll use my current android phone for the rest, if needed.
Still going to wait and see if the Eu makes a move, but i won't go back to fascist enabling corps.
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it doesn’t matter if apple cares about privacy. corpos shouldn’t have this data in the first place.
What Linux based phones are actually worth trying? Something not built on old hardware, and can actually install apps, messages people and work as a phone. And that I won’t have to chase issues and bug fixes on nonstop to keep it working. Something stable for daily use, works in multiple countries, and not just something to play around with.
Are the fair phones really that bad on Ubuntu? I was sizing those up for my next phone
So far there's this company: https://furilabs.com/shop/flx1s/
The phones actually seem really neat, they're running real Linux, with Waydroid for sandboxed android apps. But it's got... quirks. It's very GNOMEy and there's still a lot of battery issues and it can be a bit awkward to use.
Also, since apps are sandboxed, something like sending pictures over Signal can be tedious without extra steps.
But it's an exciting step forward and the devs are really involved with the community!
Alternatively I imagine there's something like PostMarket on a Fairphone. Even with their issues, I appreciate what they're trying to do.
I wanna run away to live with dogs like Diogenes. I'll live in a basket and piss and shit in the streets. No spyware phone required.
After using GrapheneOS on a gigantic fucking Android pixel model, I think I'm gravitating back towards the third option and the iphone mini I haven't dared to sell yet. I think I'll just do the things that needs privacy on my computer in the future.
My biggest issue with the alternative phones is I'm not paying a massively inflated price for bad hardware just because it's using free software, sorry. Same goes for Framework laptops. I will tolerate paying a premium, but everything about the device must match the price tag.
Buy more so that their economics and capabilities can be improved so they can sell better for cheaper.
That's how economics work, right? Someone will have to buy phones enough that it becomes financially viable to pursue the needed improvement (including eg.: getting better open hardware or even getting patents on already existing hardware released).
"My iphone battery died again!? I guess I'll have to buy another new phone. Why does this keep happening?" /s
I'm sorry I'm not buying a Linux phone or similar for the same reason I'm not going to become a mechanic to drive a car. I want to activate my SIM card and go. Out of the box. I don't want to have to know about kernel access side booting in dev mode. People like me are the primary user base for most devices.
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