this post was submitted on 06 Aug 2025
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I wonder how much it will be for push bikes...

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[–] RecallMadness@lemmy.nz 3 points 11 hours ago

As a recent EV and diesel owner, the current RUC system is dog shit.

But I’m not sure how they’re going to make it any better.

Allowing it to be post-paid when you do your WoF would just lead to a massive bill every year unless you stayed on top of it.

But what bills are the ones you don’t pay when you’re hard up? The optional ones. So that would stil impact the poorest despite “being fair”.

Unless they allow you to pay outstanding RUCs over the year, but I doubt that.

And neither of these options sound likely. The calls to “enable innovation” just sounds like a way to tack corporate fees onto a national tax.

[–] Antigrav@mastodon.nz 3 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

@BaconWrappedEnigma , I think that overall a large portion of petrol driven cars will pay quite a bit more - the reason is that a huge amount of newer cars were bought because they consumed up to half the amount that older ones did, the huge number of small, fuel friendly cars on the road atm shows this trend - so it will be a win for the tax man.
I can see that this will result in less kms driven (a good thing for the environment where it involves petrol cars), this in turn will also mean less weekend outings, less holidays further afield, and in clear text another knockout for the industry depending on it and for business in general - I hope I'm not going to be right.

[–] BaconWrappedEnigma@lemmy.nz 2 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago)

Weekend trips would contribute to the velocity of money in the economy. It's a bit hidden in your message. Are you saying we should:

  • Tax the things that are bad for the economy
  • Incentivise the things that are good for the economy

Are you also saying that this change would:

  • Disconnect incentives from fuel economy / vehicle efficiency
  • Unfairly punish people that made choices under the previous rules
  • Remove a tax from "something bad" for our economy (importing petrol)
  • Add a tax for "something good" for the economy (travel/shipping/deliveries)

I don't want to put words in your mouth. Am I reading too much into your comment? 🙂

[–] Ilovethebomb@lemmy.nz 5 points 1 day ago (2 children)

The main driving force behind this seems to be hybrids, both plug in and conventional.

It's very difficult to levy a plug in hybrid fairly, because part of their driving is on electricity, part is petrol, and the amount varies widely between vehicles, meaning with a set RUC rate, they are either getting stiffed or are freeloading, and no two are the same.

The fact that non plug in hybrids are so insanely efficient probably doesn't help either.

This is one of the few good ideas our govt has had, I think.

[–] BalpeenHammer@lemmy.nz 2 points 14 hours ago

We definitely want to discourage the purchase of fuel efficient cars that's for sure.

[–] absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz 3 points 23 hours ago

Agreed.

It has been needed since the prius became popular....

You can get some extreme efficiencies for vehicles now. It is quite unfair on those who cannot afford the latest in tech to be paying the highest road maintenance tax.

The latest corolla gets 3.8l/100. If you are driving an equivalent one from the early 2000's you are not going to be doing much better than 10l/100. So a person that can't afford a new car is paying ~2.5x the maintenance tax.

[–] Longpork3@lemmy.nz 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

This seems like a reasonable move to me, not something they come out with often.

Road maintenace costs scale by weight and distance, not by fuel usage, so streamlining the purchase of RUC and shifting the point-of-tax entirely to a separate system rather than building it into petrol prices makes sense.

My only concern is that rather than keeping the shift fiscally neutral, they may use the restructuring as an opportunity to reduce the road-maintenace tax burden on vehicles and pull more from the general tax pool instead, thus incentivising greater private vehicle usage.

[–] BalpeenHammer@lemmy.nz 2 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

They are lying when they say it will be based on cost and distance. If that was true 90% of the taxes collected would be paid by commercial traffic. Instead they will make sure 90% is paid by you and me while those loaded trucks tear up the roads at 1/10th the cost.

[–] Longpork3@lemmy.nz 1 points 12 hours ago

It already is based on weight and distance for diesel vehicles, which is all heavy trucks. Whether the current system costs all vehicles properly according to their road maintenance contribution is not something I can answer, but the heavier your vehicle is the more your road users cost for the same distance.

[–] Dave@lemmy.nz 2 points 20 hours ago* (last edited 20 hours ago) (1 children)

I agree that it seems to make sense. I'm curious about how it will work in practice though. The current RUC process is pretty shit, I can't imagine bringing millions of petrol vehicles into that process.

I know they have said they will have some digital system to solve it but it remains to be seen what exactly that will look like. Hard to do without GPS tracking every car 🙃

[–] Longpork3@lemmy.nz 2 points 19 hours ago (2 children)

Simplest option for non-gps vehicles would be to have a monthly/weekly subscription for an estimated number of kms, then verification tied in with WoF checks.

[–] Dave@lemmy.nz 1 points 16 hours ago

Yeah that makes sense. Maybe something that operates a bit like provisional tax, estimating based on the previous year.

[–] absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz 2 points 19 hours ago (1 children)

Phone/web app.

Subscription based, with the ability to input "actual readings" whenever you want, with a cross check at WoF time.

Could also make it GPS enabled, but that would have major privacy and accuracy concerns.

The current system with ordering them online is good, but could be much better. Also remove the need to display your km ticket for light vehicles.

[–] Dave@lemmy.nz 1 points 16 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago) (1 children)

Ah yes I am seeing how this could work. Sign people up, start charging them based on the average mileage. Let them enter their actuals through an app/website. At WOF time, verify actual usage. And you could adjust the auto-charging based on actual usage (e.g. if they only travelled 5,000km last year, this year you split it to that amount - a bit like how provisional tax works for income tax).

Also remove the need to display your km ticket for light vehicles.

That's on their list which is good.

The current system with ordering them online is good, but could be much better.

I had no idea when I was supposed to order another label until someone on here told me one of the numbers on the label was the end number and you compare with your odo. But if we don't have windscreen labels then that's not even going to work.

I want a system where I don't have to think about it (like petrol tax).

[–] absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz 2 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

It is easy once you are used to it.

But so many ways to make it easier.

[–] Dave@lemmy.nz 2 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

I mean there are hundreds of thousands of people across the country handling RUC fine, so I guess it can't be that bad, but it definitely feels like it could be improved.

[–] BaconWrappedEnigma@lemmy.nz 2 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

It's mildly annoying to have to remember to go buy them and the slightly unnerving when you realise you've gone over. I've never got pulled up on being over and I was unwhittingly driving around for ~3 months that way.

In rural towns I'd say enforcement is passive in that they mainly rely on vehicle sales and other events to trigger re-ups. It is weird how many diesels have broken ODOs compared to petrol cars. 🤔

[–] Dave@lemmy.nz 1 points 9 hours ago

Oh I never considered there might be consequences. I also drove around for months over the RUC km limit, and only recently thought to check and was several thousand km over.

I really hope they come up with a good system.

[–] skeezix@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

Gotta siphon more money out of the tax payers to pay the oligarchs