this post was submitted on 17 Nov 2024
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US Authoritarianism

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[–] abbadon420@lemm.ee 30 points 9 months ago (1 children)

You don't have to be in prison to be a prisoner

[–] Stovetop@lemmy.world 8 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Insert "Hey Jarvis" meme here

"Would you like to hear about the Panopticon Effect and its role in maintaining the Ideological State Apparatus?"

[–] unexposedhazard@discuss.tchncs.de 19 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Largest prison population SO FAR.

Those numbers are gonna go waay up soon.

Also if you count the nazi concentration camps then those were probably bigger but idk the number of US prisoners so enlighten me.

[–] pennomi@lemmy.world 8 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Also, raw produce numbers don’t really represent reality. Number of incarcerated persons per capita is a much better measurement.

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 6 points 9 months ago (1 children)

We're at #5 worldwide with 541 per 100,000.

[–] pyre@lemmy.world 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

China is #132. Iran #65. Russia is #33 with an even 300. So the US is nearly doubling fucking Russia's incarceration rates. although idk how that would change if you'd include the number of people falling out of windows.

[–] Stovetop@lemmy.world 4 points 9 months ago

Bear in mind that those countries are demonstrably not forthcoming with their actual incarceration rates. China especially—a lot of people know someone who was carted off for a short stay because they were heard saying the wrong thing or they posted the wrong thing online. They eventually show back up one day and everyone tries to pretend nothing ever happened.

These are "administrative" detentions, usually short and informal, not officially tracked but come with long-term consequences of reduced employment opportunities and restrictions on ability to travel.

And it's a bit crazy because usually no one knows what happened to you during this time. You get arrested, they don't have to tell you what for, but they threaten you with long term actual prison time unless you confess to something. Then there's no trial, no sentencing, just an immediate stay in a detention center for some time until they decide you're allowed to leave.

The other part of it is that China doesn't jump to jail time for a lot of things that the US would lock you up for. Robbery? Pay the victim, no jail. Assault? Pay the victim, no jail. Rape? Pay the victim, no jail. If the crime is "private" or "personal" in nature, they prefer to treat it more as a lawsuit. It's only when you do things that oppose authority or social order that get you "disappeared."

And for some serious crimes like possession of drugs, murder, or counter-revolutionary activities, they'll just sentence you to death, which is also not reported and does not come with any prison stay as it would in the US. The rate at which this occurs is estimated to be incredibly high but is not reported in any fashion.

So one day a family member just disappears, you don't know why, but you hope they just return eventually after a short stay in a detention center. But sometimes they don't.

[–] DahGangalang 5 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I expect it will, but does that ranking hold true on a per capita basis?

[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 9 points 9 months ago (1 children)
[–] SkyeStarfall@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

The ranking goes as follows

  1. El Salvador
  2. Cuba
  3. Rwanda
  4. Turkmenistan
  5. USA

Notably, all the 4 countries above the US have less than 1/10 the total amount of prisoners that the US does

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

[–] pineapplelover@lemm.ee 2 points 9 months ago

And even more now with prop 36 passing

[–] masterofn001@lemmy.ca 2 points 9 months ago

Free as in Facebook.

[–] misterdoctor@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Both things can be true. America is proof of this. Our freedom is the reason we ended up with the stupid fascist president two times. We had a (mostly) free and fair election and we used that to be really, really dumb.

[–] Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 5 points 9 months ago

Our freedom is the reason we ended up with the stupid fascist president two times.

Nope. Blind belief that a 1700s system would adequately protect the will of the people against 21st century bad actors including the kinds of mega corporations that didn't exist for decades if not a century after the founding.

We had a (mostly) free and fair election

Nope. Very far from it.