this post was submitted on 17 Feb 2024
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Lord of the memes
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I'm getting really sick of this meme format. I get it, Trump is way worse than Biden, but that doesn't mean we can't acknowledge that they're both insanely old. We'll all try to toss Biden's corpse over the finish line a second time, but stop trying to gaslight us into thinking that electing an 81 year old is normal.
It's possible to criticize Biden and be unhappy about his age without acting like him and trump are equally as bad, which a lot of "centrists" do to justify not voting. Those people are the ones being criticized in this post.
Yep. Trump voters don't give a shit. They'll vote no matter what. The people pushing the idea of not voting out of protest or whatever aren't doing it honestly, at least not the first ones. The first ones are trying to get Trump elected. They might convince some fools to also push the same message without following the agenda.
The problem is, and why Reagan made a rule to not do it, is that when you call out your own side you give your enemy a fucktonne of ammo to use against you and sway moderates.
Look what happened to Al Franken and we've DESPERATELY needed him these last few years.
I love Jon Stewart and I really enjoyed his most recent segment where he calls out both sides, making it CLEAR that trumpty dumpty is the worst offender, but it's already being used to make the moderates think that dems are abandoning Biden.
Look what happens when you refuse to call out your own side, the GOP has become a complete clown show because of it.
Yeah, but is anyone actually saying they're equally, "bad," or just that they're both too old for this? I've heard people say that both shouldn't be running but they'll vote for Biden, or that Trump is fine and Biden is senile and criminal and part of the cabal (or whatever they believe these days), but I've never heard anyone say, "both are too old, therefore they're equal and I won't vote for either." That seems like strawman meant to delegitimize criticism of Biden's age.
I have personally seen people say that so they do exist.
I've seen lots of people accused of saying that when they give any criticism of Biden, but I've yet to actually see someone actually say that. At least my personal experience is like 10:0 of people accusing a specific person of saying that to the person actually saying that. That kind of POV I saw a lot more during Obama vs Romney, but not Biden vs Trump.
Just because someone says they're not voting for someone who actively helps fund genocide doesn't mean they're saying the major alterative is equal. Just that neither major candidate passes the extremely low bar to be willing to vote for them.
I am not a centrist by any strech of the imagination, but within a pretty slim margin of error just as bad as each other. What has biden even done in his term that is a net benefit.
I'm getting tired of people going on and on about their ages as if it's something nobody noticed before. As if it's going to change the situation.
A lot of Americans like voting for old fuddy duddies. You can't control how other people vote, you can only control how you will vote. Old people vote and young people tend not to. You aren't going change anything in a democratic process by not voting.
86% of Americans think Biden is too old to be President. 62% of Americans think Trump is too old to be President. 59% of Americans think both are too old to be President. Most Americans, by a wide margin, do not like voting for, "old fuddy daddies."
Very few people are saying, "don't vote," but most people are saying, "don't allow these men to run the country." This meme is either targeting a very niche person or creating a strawman for the majority of people by equating, "these men are too old," with, "these men are the same, don't vote."
The presidential election isn't democratic. In fact, it's antidemocratic by design.
With that said, you won't change anything voting between two conservatives either.
What's the deal with this certainty that this is the result of people's will? I'm more inclined to beleive it is a systemic result of 'winner takes all' logic and the penetration of political and media institutions by bad actors.
oh is that what this meme is about?
Remember that any criticism of Biden, no matter how legitimate, is definitely pro-trump Russian propaganda. God forbid people don't just want to vote against something.
At the end of the day, this is how it is. The system is absurdly broken. We couldn't possibly be here if it wasn't. The fact that they keep shoving Biden at us doesn't mean that we shouldn't choose him over the much more overt fascist Trump, but it also doesn't mean that we should accept him.
No matter who's elected, everyone should fucking riot.
If you really think that to be the case then democracy is already dead and Putin has won.
Liberal democracy was a scam before Putin was born. Putin just exploited it's weakness, like all fascists do.
There was found no evidence that Putin engaged in any illegal election interference.
How the Fuck does that work, You are sauing that no one is alowed to have and air grevences of the PRESIDENT, or gosh even worse try to hold them accountable because "the other guy is Trump" Look I get it, I do not like trump either, but FFS grow up, not everyone who is complaining is pro-trump, not everything anti-biden or pro trump is russian. Trump is very much a home grown american thing, and you cannot start to adress the socital issues untill you accept that.
Also Putin himself said he would perfer Biden... or are you going to twist yourself into knots about how that means he wants Trump
Any time someone criticizes Biden a bunch of liberals crawl out of the woodwork and yell about how you're pro-Trump and a Russian asset and all sorts of shit like that. What you quoted is mostly sarcasm.
The vice presidential debate is more important than ever.
No it's not, it's end of (or decline of) democracy vs current (shitty) state of democracy.
You're not the target of the meme if you're able to understand that voting for Biden is a necessity.
Its an extortion
As a Tolkien fan and someone who hates voting for octagenarians, this post triggers me more than I'd like to admit.
Equating the upcoming election to this isn't a choice between Saruman and Gandalf, it's between Saruman and Sauron, but instead of picking either of those guys, you pick Aragorn, who Gandalf really likes.
So what we should do, instead of voting for either, is ask ~~Gandalf~~ Bernie Sanders who he'd like to be president and vote for that guy.
Also, the whole "line of kings is broken" portion of this joke feels way to close to an RFK Jr. joke for my taste. The man's insane.
It really does bother me that so few are willing to recognize what a shitty president Biden has been.
I mean, if you're a wage earner in half of the US states, Biden did jack shit to help you and you can still be legally paid $7 an hour, but he moved heaven and earth to make more money appear out of thin air for Israel, Ukraine, and other miscellaneous wars when he's already budgeted a trillion dollars for war.
I don't understand why I shouldn't expect a progressive use the power of the presidency to make real positive change as hard as Trump used it to try and ban Muslims.
Also Biden is supporting Israel in its genocide against the Palestinians. A muslim political analyst coined it this way:
"Why should you vote for the guy that is commiting genocide, over the person that might commit genocide? Commiting genocide must be a red line to not vote someone."
was trump significantly worse? I mean his retoric was awful yes, and he was a mask off facist, but Biden has done almost nothing to undo what trump started, and in some cases has activly sped it up, the only difrence that I can see is that Biden talks more polite
🔬🎻
I don't think I've seen anyone doing that, it's just a very easy choice. Deal with Biden after the guy who isn't losing his mind due to old age is out of the picture. At least Biden is under the control of his support staff.
And learn what gaslighting is if you're so eager to use that annoying buzzword.
Is the implication here that Trump isn't losing his mind due to old age? Motherfucker have you heard him speak??
He was an egomaniac from day one.
Trump's losing his mind has little to do with age. He never had much up there to start with.
A) I was using gaslightimg in its more general sense of making someone question their sense of reality, in this case by making concerns about Biden's age seem silly or unfounded, even though they are very reasonable and shared by the majority of Americans. If you think it should only be used to describe the form of psychological abuse, fair enough, that is closer to the, "real," definition, but remember that both uses are colloquialisms, and, "gaslight," is and always has been a pop-psychology term, not a clinical one.
B) Why the hell is it a good strategy to ignore Biden's age until after Trump is gone? 86% of the country thinks he's too old to be President. 73% of Democrats think he is too old to be President. In a functioning democracy, a real primary would have been held; Biden probably would have lost to a younger candidate, who probably would have gone on to beat Trump, since 62% of the country thinks he's too old to he President.
As I said, if the alternative is Trump, we should all vote Biden and let the DNC Weekend at Bernie's him through another term. But running a candidate that 86% of Americans think isn't fit to be President is not a smart or reasonable strategy, it's an insane and unnecessary risk.
I don't know about american politics, but how did Biden win primary?
Last election, Bernie Sanders was winning, which the DNC didn't like, so as soon as Biden won a state they pressured all the othe candidates to drop out and endorse him. This year, there simply isn't a real opponent.
Isn't he even older than Biden? There wasn't someone more... fresh?
The sad thing is there really isn't. America lives under a gerontocracy, and the Democratics are especially bad a elevating new, young voices in their party. Dianne Feinstein was 90 years old and had dementia and the Democrats didn't force her to resign. She served as a senator while experiencing cognitive decline for at least the last two of her life before dying in office.
Even the, "new," faces that are coming up are old. Every now and then you get a Pete Buttigieg, but by and large, most of the potential presidential candidates will be pushing retirement age by the next election. Gavin Newsom will be 60, Kamala Harris will be 63, Amy Klobuchar will be 67...they may not be quite as old as Biden, but I certainly wouldn't call them, "fresh."
Is there anyone at most 20 years old? Maybe 30?
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is 34. The DNC hates her because she's very progressive and unseated Joe Crowley, who everyone expected would take over the speakership from Nancy Pelosi. That being said, the Constitution says that the President has to be at least 35 years old, and I think most Americans would prefer an experienced politician that's in their mid 40s to early 50s for President. We need younger law makers though, people in their 20s and 30s.
I think starting from 20 y.o. 5 year term in municipal council and 5 year term as governor or in regional council is experienced more than enough. How it comes 18 years is old enough to die in trenches, but too young to be president? But I guess it's better to simply say Americans are Americans.
Same here
But this image isn't making out it's a reasonable situation, is it? It's emphasising just how easy a decision it is, albeit by hyperbole.
Well, my comment was mostly directed your claim that we should, "deal with Biden," after the election. If Trump is as dangerous as the Dems say he is (which, to be clear, I think he is), that's a lot like saying, "we can talk about putting Grandpa in a home after he drives the kids to soccer practice."
To your point about the meme, is there anyone that's actually struggling with this decision? I've never encountered anyone who claims their equally bad (online or IRL), but I know a lot of people (apparently 59% of Americans) that think they're both too old to be President. So, to me, this meme is delegitimizing criticism of Biden's age by falsely equating those two positions.
No it's just stressing how much worse Trump is regardless. It's preaching to the converted, I don't think it's trying to rationalise issues with Biden, it's poking fun there, too.
I mean, this meme is clearly making fun of someone, it just comes down to whether it's a real, common viewpoint or a person the author made up in their head to get mad at.
Gandalf is Biden, Saruman is Trump. Biden is being played down and ridiculed, Trump is being compared to a murderous lunatic whom anyone is, however regrettably, a better option to.
...yeah, and there is a first person narrator saying that they're both, "so old," and, "equally bad choices," whose indecisiveness is being mocked. That strawman is what I've been complaining about, are you not following this?
That's sarcastic.