this post was submitted on 19 Dec 2023
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[–] Cowbee@lemm.ee 158 points 2 years ago (78 children)

There's nuance. Obviously, vote for the liberal over the fascist, it's not even close. However, the fascists are absolutely represented in government, while there's no leftist candidates to speak of. Leftists have to plug their nose and vote liberal, while fascists gleefully vote republican.

Voting is entirely for loss prevention, because ultimately it absolutely impacts minority groups and people who stand to lose a great deal by a republican victory. However, leftists will not be able to move America to the left by voting.

That's why grassroots movements and building up of parallel structures are so important for leftism, it cannot work within the confines of a 2 party Capitalist state, and must be built from the bottom up.

[–] assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world 11 points 2 years ago (5 children)

This is very well written and well said. If we want change that doesn't come from working within the Democrats, we have to build our own robust party across all 50 states, drawing on strong local support. No one outside of the two parties is currently trying to do this, which speaks volumes about the Green and Libertarian Parties.

Leftists really have no choice other than to vote Democrat. We have to protect people who would be targeted by Republicans. We fundamentally go against left wing values if we don't. I cannot call myself liberal or leftist or wherever in-between if I sit out an election where innocent people will suffer if one of the candidates wins.

I like how you've phrased this -- voting for Biden isn't because you necessarily like his policies or viewpoints, but because you want to protect people from Trump and the Republicans. I'd love if we didn't have to worry about fascists, but we don't have that luxury. As long as they're a hair's breadth away from power, we pick the option that opposes them.

[–] Cowbee@lemm.ee 9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Exactly. There's one terminally online radlib here that I blocked because they were just shit-slinging for daring to suggest both voting Biden and unionizing, organizing, protesting, etc. As a leftist, we must work from without the Democratic party.

Speaking purely from a leftist perspective, I'm actually of the opinion that Anarchist principles of building up parallel structures actually may be more applicable to the American political climate, even if you're more of a Council Communist, Libertarian Socialist, Marxist-Leninist, etc. The US is seeing rising Unionization, and dramatic impacts from it, so I think Syndicalism actually has some revolutionary potential, unlike waiting for a Vanguard Party a la MLism.

Just my 2 cents.

[–] assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It's funny, I thought that unions had passed their usefulness, and we needed a new structure to effectively push CEOs. And then the UAW and SAG proved me completely wrong, and I'm glad for it.

I think either way, you have the perfect viewpoint on this. Voting won't work to create change, but that doesn't mean you just ignore voting. You use it to protect what we have from fascists while initiating change from a new organization built from the ground up.

[–] Cowbee@lemm.ee 4 points 2 years ago

I'm extremely anticapitalist, and Unions are currently the best way for Workers to protect their own interests within current structures, and have the potential to replace current Capitalist ownership. A full replacement of Capitalist structures will be necessary eventually, but Unionization can be an arm to muscle that change through.

Thanks for sharing!

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