this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2023
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Yes, they can play dirty, but so does everyone else, so no surprise there.
If by 'playing dirty' you mean 'committing heinous war crimes', no that's not an everyone thing. Sure, the US is also very guilty of it, and needs to be judged accordingly, but that isn't justification for Russia doing the same and more to Ukraine.
I bet you're not as "loud" when US war crimes are in question...
I literally just called out the US for its war crimes and said they should be judged for it...
And I don't recall even the US going as far as to kidnap thousands of children to strip them of their identities.
Yeah, you did... but that is not why we're here, are we.
My point is, US liberals like to say "oh yeah, the US is also bad, but take a look at what that guy is doing"... if the US minded their own business from time to time, I'm confident the world would be a much better place to live in.
Sure. I'm also confident that if Russia did the same, it would also be a better place to live in too.
I don't deny the US does some incredibly messed up shit, hell I don't deny that the US needs to be tried for war crimes, but that's not justification for another country to do the same to a third country.
Actually, it is. If everyone respected the rules set by the UN, there would probably be no war crimes at all. But one side breaks them, then the other... it's a slipery slope after that.
No it's not. It's a shitty excuse. It'd be one thing if Russia was fighting an opponent who was also subjecting their people to war crimes en masse, but that isn't what's happening. This is just silly whataboutism, not a moral justification.
There is no moral justification from one side or the other. Everyone does things they're not proud of. It's just life. You do shit and live with the conseqences. Everyone does that, even heads of state and their partners. Why they do that? That's a whole different question and depends on the pros and cons regarding that decision. My best guess is either power, money or political gain. Everyone does it, the US is no different.
There is. Ukraine is acting in self defense.
Well, they kinda asked for it. They were told not to apply for NATO membership numerous times (this is the real reason why the war started... this and land, but mostly this). When you have a powerful neighbour like Russia, you can't just do whatever you want. USA planting it's ass in Russia's back yard is not something you get to play with. Same thing, but reversed, was with the Cuban missile crisis, but Russia backed off.
You don't get to do whatever you want when you have powerfull neighbours.
And Russia proved valid their reasons for doing so.
But jesus fucking christ, you call that a justification for a complete and total invasion?
That's like blaming a rape victim because they wore revealing clothing.
You don't get to pick and choose your fights with powerful neighbours. We have a saying, power doesn't pray to god. You have to avoid fights with someone who is 20 times your size. Those are just simple facts of life. A monkey doesn't challenge a gorilla for it's territory.
Bro, Russia had already annexed parts of Ukraine in 2014. Russia already proved that they don't give a rat's dick about provocation or lack thereof.
Ukraine would have been stupid to not jump at a chance to join NATO at this point. There was already a clear need for an insurance policy against a Russian invasion.
Seriously dude, how much of a tankie do you have to be to keep victim blaming Ukraine?
Ukraine could have gulped and kept on opening markets towards the east (China and the likes... which is what Russia wants, no doubt there). They should have kept close relations with Russia, even after the annexation, cuz... you know, it's Russia, they can prertty much do whatever they want π€·.
And going on with that logic "my body, my choice", here is where we end up. Thousands of civillians dead, soldiers as well, and they still won't get what they want - being a part of NATO. Russia will never ever let that happen and the war won't stop unless they completely fall back on this.
As I said, you can't do whatever you want when your neighbour is an ex heavyweight champ. Sure, you can call the cops if pushing comes to shoving, but do consider what that person can do to you in the 5, 10 minutes that will take for the police to arrive.
There is literally nothing they could have done that would have kept Russia from invading. Do you keep forgetting they annexed Crimea in 2014?
That was an easy target, plus the population there is mostly Russian, so there was no objection or resistance from the local population. Putin knew this, that's why they went for it. On the other hand, there was going to be war if he tried the same with the rest of Ukraine. And I agree, after reasurrances that Ukraine won't try and be a part of NATO, Russia still finds an excuse to attack, yes, there is no way avoiding war. But, this option was never tried, so we'll never know...
So, when did Ukrainian military bomb Russian civilian infrastructure? I'd like to learn more about that, so that I have something to ask my own government about
Oh please, the US have done that as well, numerious times, then try to cover that shit up. That's nothing new.
Was I asking about the US? Or did Ukraine become another state, while I was asleep?
You didn't, but you should be.