Western support for Ukraine as it defends against Russia has globally significant consequences, Polish President Andrzej Duda said Tuesday, urging Kyiv’s backers to remain steadfast.

“It is about making sure that Russia is not able legally to forcefully shift the borders in Europe,” Duda told CNN’s Jake Tapper in an interview from the United Nations headquarters in New York.

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[–] Fried_out_Kombi@lemmy.world 63 points 2 years ago (15 children)

This is exactly what I don't understand about people who want peace in Ukraine as soon as possible and at all costs: capitulation for the sake of short-term peace endangers long-term peace.

If we globally set the precedent that you can invade whomever you want and win just because you have nukes, that makes for a vastly more dangerous world. Every country with nukes will suddenly be more willing to go all imperialist, and all the countries without nukes will want to have them as a guarantee against invasion. And I don't know about y'all, but a world with way more nukes in way more hands is way more dangerous.

Plus, Putin has shown he'll keep on invading neighbors so long as he can get away with it. Delivering a crushing defeat to Russia and specifically Putin is the only way to achieve a more lasting peace.

[+] gnuhaut@lemmy.ml -34 points 2 years ago (6 children)

Putin has shown he’ll keep on invading neighbors so long as he can get away with it

How the fuck has he shown that? How many countries has Russia invaded since Putin got into power?

Even the US foreign policy people have been warning that Russia won't accept NATO in Ukraine. This is why they invaded, not because Putin is a serial invader, because he very clearly isn't. You know who are actually serial invaders? The US and their NATO entourage.

[–] FluffyPotato@lemm.ee 12 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Georgia and Russia is creating conditions in Moldova exactly like in Georgia and Ukraine prior to invasion. It's pretty safe to say Moldova will be invaded in the future if Russia wins.

Ukraine had exactly zero chance to get into NATO.

[+] gnuhaut@lemmy.ml -9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/sep/30/georgia-attacks-unjustifiable-eu

EU investigation says Tbilisi launched indiscriminate assault on South Ossetia

An investigation into last year's Russia-Georgia war delivered a damning indictment of President Mikheil Saakashvili today, accusing Tbilisi of launching an indiscriminate artillery barrage on the city of Tskhinvali that started the war.

In more than 1,000 pages of analysis, documentation and witness statements, the most exhaustive inquiry into the five-day conflict dismissed Georgian claims that the artillery attack was in response to a Russian invasion, accused both sides of violations of the laws of war, indicated that war crimes had been perpetrated against Georgian civilians and rejected Russian claims of "genocide" in the breakaway Georgian province of South Ossetia.

[–] FluffyPotato@lemm.ee 9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Just like in Ukraine Russia created breakaway regions by funding terrorist groups or outright sending their own military 'on vacation' into the region. And just like in Ukraine those breakaway regions are not part of Russia so the conflict there is not an excuse for Russia to invade. And as I said this exact situation is currently developing in Moldova so we have 3 examples of this exact strategy being employed.

[–] Slotos@feddit.nl 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Funny how those articles the useful idiots share never link to the report in question.

https://www.echr.coe.int/documents/d/echr/HUDOC_38263_08_Annexes_ENG

Turns out, report doesn’t claim what the articles claim. What it does do, however, is engage in a useful “both sides are to blame”, “green men didn’t have official patches”, and “think of the ~~children~~ human suffering” sophistry that Russians just fucking love to spin into a disinformation campaign. Oh, and it immediately starts with authors absolving themselves from any responsibility and claims of having discovered truth.

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