this post was submitted on 29 Mar 2026
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[–] maplesaga@lemmy.world -1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)
[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

What a problematic framing you got there.

On a discussion about wait times, how does "low skilled" matter? It looks more like a racist/classist dog whistle to me. But since you went there... the increased immigration to Canada in the last decade was not "low skilled", it included people of all sorts of skill levels, including for example the many many many people that came to Canada on study permits and who are by definition not "low skill" and are by definition in an up-skill trajectory. Among the new arrivals many were in healthcare providing professions. I personally know of an Italian doctor who left after a year and of a Tunisian nurse who drives a cab. That our archaic credentials recognition system is unable to put them to work is not their fault. The solution is not "less migration" but "faster integration" from the airport to scrubs.

Not to mention of course that many of the new student arrivals would love to go into the healthcare professions, if given the chance. But our system actively discourages people from going to med school for example, with elitist fees and with non recognition of credentials from other countries. If we wanted we could have translated a part of the "mass migration" to a "mass training of doctors and nurses".

Your question is also disingenuous. Whether "mass immigration" had an effect and whether it had the decisive effect matters, especially if the real question that matters is what do we do to fix waiting times (and not the ick that "masses of unskilled brown people and their grandmothers" seem to be giving you). Because then we get into real question of what among the causes of long waiting times we can address with what policy levers. Chronic underfunding and underinvestment, chronic underpayment, overwork and burnout of workers, a pay-to-play education system that excludes people from the medical profession, an archaic credentials recognition system that wastes the abilities of immigrants, union busting and back to work legislation, a badly designed primary and preventive care system. But those are boring things that don't have an easy scapegoat like "immigrants bad".

And we are also ignoring the elephant in the room here that is ... the COVID-19 pandemic, that either killed a bunch of healthcare workers outright, or gave them long term disabilities, or burned them out when the Poilievrite crowd turned on them because of vaccine misinformation. The people that complain about immigrants the loudest are the same people who were yelling at doctors and nurses outside hospitals just a few short years ago. Oh we have not forgotten what the Right did to healthcare workers.

Speaking of COVID-19 and yelling at people. The most iconic pandemic era right wing movement was the "truckers" convoy. On the one hand, the majority of truckers were South Asian immigrants and were vaccinated. On the other hand, the loud obnoxious idiots in Ottawa who were also screaming about white genocide and mass migration were a small minority of mostly white truckers. What a perfect case study of who treats healthcare responsibly. The vaccinated immigrants who just wanted to do their jobs or the unvaccinated xenophobic diagonalists chilling under police protection in inflatable hot tubs who wanted to copy MAGA and overthrow the newly elected Trudeau government to stop being "replaced" by immigrants.

...

The problem with thought stopping bullshit bullets is that they are tweet sized but debunking them takes up time and effort.

[–] 102@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago

“truckers” convoy.

or, IIRC, as one (NDP-voting) trucker I know put it, "the owner-operators".

[–] maplesaga@lemmy.world -2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Being low skilled matters because they aren't doctors or nurses, and tend to be fast food workers or uber drivers. Whether they were doctors in their own country is irrelevant, as this is a problem with the mass immigration policy regardless.

They also tend to require more government support than the taxes they contribute since Canada has a highly progressive tax policy. So we had capital shallowing, wages were depressed via diminished wage pressure, and now we have a failing social safety net and failing food bank system.

In April 2022, the federal government announced changes to the TFWP that would ease hiring caps for low-wage workers, remove hiring restrictions based on regional unemployment and extend work permits (Employment and Social Development Canada, 2022). Additional measures were announced later in in 2022, including a possible 18-month extension for post-graduate workers whose permit did or would expire between September 2021 and December 2022 (Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, 2022).

https://www.bankofcanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/sdp2025-8.pdf

Calling anyone who disagrees with answering the Tim Horton's lobbyists calls for cheap labor a racist is how we got here, the neo-liberals have been weaponizing language. So sure the housing shortage is caused by regressive and sprawled zoning laws, high developer taxes, greenbelt, etc, but in the end immigration should be tied to housing completions, and you're a fool who hates poor Canadians if you disagree.

[–] 102@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Being low skilled matters because they aren’t doctors or nurses, and tend to be fast food workers or uber drivers. Whether they were doctors in their own country is irrelevant, as this is a problem with the mass immigration policy regardless.

The problem is also outdated and insular accreditation that reduces the skilled to unskilled roles.

They also tend to require more government support than the taxes they contribute since Canada has a highly progressive tax policy.

Sales and fuel taxes aren't progressive, and as many are young and childless, they probably require less health care and child services.

In April 2022, the federal government announced changes to the TFWP that would ease hiring caps for low-wage workers, remove hiring restrictions based on regional unemployment and extend work permits (Employment and Social Development Canada, 2022). Additional measures were announced later in in 2022, including a possible 18-month extension for post-graduate workers whose permit did or would expire between September 2021 and December 2022 (Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada, 2022).

and your point is ..., ?

https://www.bankofcanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/sdp2025-8.pdf

Please cite relevant points from this 42-page document.

Calling anyone who disagrees with answering the Tim Horton’s lobbyists calls for cheap labor a racist is how we got here,

Not all of them are racists, but I suspect most are.

the neo-liberals have been weaponizing language. So sure the housing shortage is caused by regressive and sprawled zoning laws, high developer taxes, greenbelt, etc, but in the end immigration should be tied to housing completions, and you’re a fool who hates poor Canadians if you disagree.

Canada is about 9.6 million sq km in size. I think reforming regressive and sprawled zoning laws, high developer taxes, and NIMBY laws would pretty much solve the problem.

[–] maplesaga@lemmy.world -1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

I mean I think we agree on a lot, but you're fine to put the cart before the horse. You'd rather ad hominem attack people as racist rather than acknowledging reality of our current circumstances, while I'd just prefer the poor aren't continuously ground into dust by bad policy that debases salaries and exacerbates shortages.

Excuse my rudeness, its been rough watching a decade of this.

[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

You're monomaniacally stuck on blaming immigrants. Every problem in this country you bring back to immigration. Immigrants to blame for unemployment, to blame for housing, to blame for healthcare. Every other thread I've interacted with you, same shit.

You correctly blame the neoliberals for fucking us over. You correctly identify conservative zoning policies as a cause. But then you never dare look upstream. Never actually challenge the economic basis that created these problems. You accept that economic basis, and always you still go back to blaming immigrants. This "cart before the horse" analogy is precisely telling of the kind of nativist politics you're peddling. Ever look downstream, never upstream.

You claim to be speaking for the poor Canadians, but that's bullshit. You don't really care, not where it matters. Because in your brain if the bad immigrants go away, then we'll go to the good old days, right? When poor Canadians supposedly did not have to compete with bad immigrants for scraps. See your problem is the competing part, not the scraps part.

So while you do go some way towards identifying the problem, you just don't have the courage to name its source. You just fixate on immigrants. So all you do is either carry water for the Maple MAGA or maybe you're one of them.

[–] 102@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

There may be valid concerns about increased immigration, but they're often tainted—spoiled even—by the bigots.

To me "Illegal immigration" is a dog whistle for immigration.

If Canada had a "whites-only" immigration policy, I doubt half of those complaining about foreigners working at Tim Hortons would continue to do so.

Housing shortages, IMO, are relatively easily dealt with in the 2nd largest country on the planet.

e.g. FWIW, wp:Manitouwadge doesn't seem to have a housing problem. e.g. https://www.royallepage.ca/en/on/manitouwadge/properties/

The weather currently looks colder https://weather.gc.ca/en/location/index.html?coords=49.141%2C-85.844 but probably not much worse than what Toronto had last February.

Presumably under true competition among employers at least, lower wages lead to lower costs. People pay less for service, but if they want workers to get more money, then maybe increase the minimum wage to Ca$20 (≈US$14)/hr.

Would the average person who complains about immigration be willing to pay, say, an extra 25¢ for a coffee or donut, if it meant the lowest paid worker there got ≥Ca$20 (≈US$14)/hr?