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Correct. Scientists have done studies on vibrations from plants and they have a reaction to being cut and pulled that could be equated to a "pain" response.
Let's suppose that you actually genuinely care about reducing the amount of plant suffering in the world. If this is the case, surely you would be vegan, because 3/4 of our total agricultural land is used to grow plants to support animal agriculture. (Since grass feels pain just like soybeans do, this includes pasture land.) So far fewer plants would be killed if everyone was vegan.
Of course, you don't actually live your life in a manner consistent with believing plants feel pain. I don't think anyone would think twice about swerving into some flowers to avoid a dog in the street for fear of causing suffering to the flowers.
Do you have any idea how many animals and bugs suffer at the hands of your monocultures in to produce soybeans and tofu? They destroy the habitat, poison the ground and the water, and make it impossible for most things to live on vast tracks of land. They interrupt migration patterns of larger animals.
You guys must all be small scale organic farmers like me! Surely if you cared about all life so much, you would be doing more of your personal space to accommodate? Shall we analyze your diet Friend? Let us discuss what you were eating and how you are acquiring it.
Cmon let's be real, again this is a very simple trophic levels thing. If you truly care about the suffering of all the field mice and bugs and whatever being killed in soybean monocultures, and their other various environmental harms, then surely you would be vegan, because 75% of all soybeans grown globally are used as animal feed. (Source)
I truly care about the health of the planet and our many diverse eco-systems. I truly believe in the mountain of science on the subject. I truly believe in the laws of nature. The cycle of life and death that forms the eco-system. I think your vegan farming is just as bad as the meat farmers. Vast tracks of land poisoned to produce soy protein, fuel corn, palm oil and what ever else you need to create such an unnatural diet. I truly believe that eating food you produce and that is local to you is the real ethical choice. A healthy cow farm benefits the neighboring veggie farm, macro fauna increase biodiversity and manage plants. There's a lot going on in the natural world, I'd rather not see it all get replaced by ignorance, self righteousness and Soylent.
they're saying they don't and neither does anyone else. it's a silly concern: animals die, and humans eat animals.
a soybean is about 20% oil. about 85% of all soybeans are pressed for oil, that leaves about 69% of the total soybean crop as industrial waste if it's not fed to animals. another 7% is fed directly to livestock. only 7% of all soybeans are grown for animals.
I understand the core of your argument: "animals can eat parts of the plant that humans can't, so it's most efficient to use those as animal feed instead of wasting them." But this is not really engaging with the source I posted above, showing that, indeed, farmed animals are directly fed only 7% of all raw soybeans produced in the world, but 69% of all soybeans are specifically produced to be turned into high-protein processed animal feed, for a total of 76%.
From your previous comments though, it doesn't really seem like you're engaging in good faith. Feel free to have the last word, have a great day
no. 85% are pressed for oil, and the waste product is 69% of the soybean crop. that is fed to animals.
I doubt this
That's ok, totally understandable. Just read the comment again
still not convinced
How so? Have you seen the energy pyramid diagram?
The one I am referring to is specifically figure 2
much of what animals eat are parts of plants people can't or won't eat. I don't actually believe any fewer plants would be harmed if people were vegan.
Because instead of having to feed one creature, you have two creatures to feed. Still not clear?
if I grow a plant like corn, and I eat the kernels, and feed the cobs, stalk and ruffage to a cow, only one plant is harmed.
Thing is, cattle is also fed with corn. Lots of it. More than you could eat yourself, compared to meat consumption.
While this likely pans out with historical methods of meat production, alongside historical quantities of meat consumption, it breaks down when scaled up.
This would signal towards a reduced meat consumption across a population. On an individual level, removing meat from the diet would be beneficial to offset those who aren't reducing.
maybe it would be if the industry changed it's production based on consumption. I don't think that happens though
They aren't producing for funsies. If people are buying less, they're going to produce less in order to maximize their profit. If they don't ramp down production in response to reduced consumption, they are losing money.
that has never happened and there is no reason to believe it would
Lots of businesses have scaled down production when demand for their product has declined. Lines literally get discontinued if demand drops low enough.
oh. I thought the discussion was about meat
Yes, because demand is increasing.
If demand were decreasing, then the chart would look different.
there is no way to prove or disprove this claim. it's pure storytelling.
So companies are going to continue to produce a product that people aren't buying? That would be a rather weird thing to do.
no iPhones were bought in 2005
You’re talking to vegans not biologists or ecologists. They don’t have any idea how their food is grown, or what the ecosystem it’s grown in can support.
I’ll share your downvotes o7