this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2025
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Liberals are capitalists though. Just in a "I can fix her" kind of way
Liberals don't believe in capitalism... No one does. It's descriptive, not prescriptive
Liberals believe in rules. That you can tweak the rules and eventually you'll end up with a perfect system of government
Obviously that doesn't work, but a true liberal is a midwit with good intentions. I'd take that all day right now
"language is descriptive, not prescriptive"
Gods, what an utterly myopic defense. You do know there is a difference between colloquial language for the purpose of simple communication and theoretical language for the purpose of in-depth systemic analysis, right?
Don't make excuses for being willfully ignorant of political theory.
I think I'm making an important point here.
It's really important that we stop pretending that these people believe their bullshit. The difference between liberals and the neo-liberals we have now isn't more belief in capitalism, it's that they've been bribed directly and indirectly
If you say they believe in capitalism, you're giving ground. There's an implication that they believe their actions will lead to better outcomes... But they so obviously don't
Liberals are literally the source of capitalism and capitalism is the source of liberals. They are undeniably linked. The liberal Revolution was the capitalist Revolution. You cannot have one without the other. They adhere to the capitalist mindset brutally and without question. The last 300 years of human history is that story.
Liberals believe in strong private property rights, which is one of the most core tenents of how capitalism works. It allows capitalists to accumulate their private property and hold it for profit. And by "believe", I mean they advocate for this dynamic / structure.
I think that's a really good point. Strong property rights is a better way to put it, I'm going to add that from now on
But the reason why I'm splitting hairs is because we're at the point where they're trying to privatize the FAA. In fact, they partially have under Trump 1, which is why the planes are breaking - we let airline companies inspect themselves
And it's not because Republicans believe in capitalism
The problem we have isn't some belief system, it's just naked corruption
Correct. While a lot of conservatives are liberals to some extent, a large number of them are becoming increasingly fascist. I appreciate this dialog we had here.
The whole world is capitalist. Changing it at this point seems unrealistic. Limiting it and controlling it seems more viable.
People said the same thing of the divine right of kings and look how that turned out.
Any power that is created by human hands can be dismantled by them.
Kings and queens are a political ideology not an economical and financial one. As much as I do agree progress would be nice and welcomed, banks and capitalism has been around for centuries. We can't go back to shared markets and good for exchange. We are too specialized as a populace. What else is there?
Wow, you completely missed the point.
Nothing is set in stone. Everything that exists today are imaginary social structures, including but not limited to the entire concept of economics and finances, that 100% can be altered or removed in their entirety.
Go read political theory and educate yourself to find the alternatives. There are many.
It's not a political solution. It's an economical one. Which I have an education on.
So maybe you should go read some books and stop acting like some stuffy asshole. I don't need to be educated by people who's head is so far up their ass they can't actually present anything besides insufferable annoyance when conversing with another human.
How fucking stupid are you that you do not understand politics and economics are intrinsically linked? You cannot have an economy without the overarching government that dictates its structure.
You have no education that matters for these purposes if you don't even know this most fundamental basic.
I don't owe you a conversation, fyi. I have no interest in a discussion with a simp for the owning-class
You can link lots of things. But it doesn't change the implementation of it. You are too dumb to realize that. You responded. That's what you owe me. If you chose to engage you can use that little flesh eaten cavity affixed on your neck to discuss things.
Fuckin moron
Yea, I responded how I choose to do. I don't owe you a discussion. You're not worth discussing with, and it's been readily apparent from the moment you first replied with that bs, bad faith question.
You're utterly ignorant if you think that the structure of politics doesn't alter the implementation of economic systems. You really are stupid.
You don't know me. And it showcases how ignorant you are in assuming you do. I am asking for alternative. No one has one. And everyone makes it personal rather than logical.
You are too dumb to listen to or even debate with. So fuck off. Bitch.
lol quit being such an asshole.
I will when people start making sense
Learn to read and maybe you will get it 🤣
You first
That's exceptionally defeatist.
Like, in what way is that viable? This is a hostile system that should be viewed as an assailant, not as a competing ideal that can be reasoned and compromised with.
Feudalism is a political ideology and not an economical one.
This is a bit defeatist, wouldn't you agree? A lot of people use the same argument to fight against climate protection actions
That is not apples to apples. One is scientific and an opinion on our effect on this living breathing rock. The other is objectively correct. Capitalism is everywhere. In varying degrees and control.
Capitalism is everywhere. So are our efforts to destroy our ecosystem. Changing it at this point seems unrealistic. I mean, you could make this point, but it is indeed defeatist. But to be fair, on short term I would also pick severely limiting and controlling capitalism over a sudden revolution. As a start, let's get rid of billionaires. That would help making any change further down the road, because there won't be a class of people with incredible power that will try to prevent any change.
It's not defeatist to say the sky is blue and we breath oxygen but we need to optimize keeping the sky blue and the right amount of oxygen. Would I be ok with an alternative? Absolutely. But I don't see one and I am asking all that object my observation to present a viable alternative.
Smart people worldwide used to say that democracy had been tried and failed. What's unrealistic is expecting capitalism to last forever.
Which smart people? There are plenty examples of it working correctly in Europe.
Thomas Aquinas, Niccolò Machiavelli, Jean Bodin, Thomas Hobbes, Blaise Pascal, Voltaire, and more. It was the prevailing opinion before the French revolution. There were plenty of examples of feudalism "working correctly" before we had a good example of democracy.
Every societal idea is a bad idea before it works. Whatever comes after capitalism has almost certainly been proposed already, and gets dismissed like democracy was. That's what social progress actually looks like.
If they're so smart, why don't they have a TikTok?!
/S
I do think it's important to clarify that America was the first modern democracy, so others learned from our mistakes while we refuse to learn lessons from anyone else. With a big qualifier that only white male landowners could vote and while Black slaves were "represented" in amount of House members, they had no vote themselves, their owners and other white male landowners just got disproportionate representation.
When talking about government systems, "first is worst" shouldn't surprise anyone , but it continually does.
Thank you for actually answering the question. However I see feudalism as a political concept and not a financial one.
Short term? Sure. Long term? Nope
How do you figure?
Capitalism should be dismantled. Eroding the foundation is a good start, not an end goal.
How? If you don't have a replacement all you are doing is wasting everyone's time. Just calling it shitty isn't enough. How are people going to get food and shelter and live?
Socialism / communism. Have productive private property owned by all and not the few.
I hear you. I wish we had better examples than the USSR and China. We are a socialist society. However the controls got out of hand.
This is naivety in thinking capitalism gives people food and shelter. That is done through human hands laboring to create and then distribute those things.
Capitalism only restricts access based on the private property system of ownership then makes us of the working class compete against each other for the privilege of buying it back with imaginary tokens of value from those who have claimed private ownership over it and the means of producing it.
Other systems exist. You have the ability to educate yourself on them.
Then educate me. I have a degree in business and been through the system where it's never been discussed. Please tell me what else exists in the world that works.
Nice try framing the question with arbitrary qualifications to what you, personally, would consider a valid answer. Too bad I don't respect your authority to determine what is or isn't valid.
Ooooh, you have a degree in "business"? Please just announce for the whole class that you're biased as fuck to any answer I would give. (B/BS/M)BA's are such bullshit, nothing more than capitalist brainwashing, teaching people how to best maximize the profits of the owning class and uphold the interests of this exploitative system of economics.
You forget that societal systems don't exist until they are created. Capitalism used to never exist and, during its infancy, was argued extensively by the ruling class of the time that it didn't "work", yet now we live in a world where it feels inescapable. So, to your logic, I guess people back then never should have tried to create a new system in which to better their lives because that system wasn't one that "exists in the world that works".
Please, miss me with your simple minded bullshit.
Blah blah blah. Someone actually knows things when you try to discuss it and you sound like some washed undergrad that doesn't have any actual solutions rather than spite.
Nah. Business degrees are indeed bullshit.
Ok. You die on that hill. I'm convinced you started an argument you didn't know shit about.
I didn’t start shit. I’m just letting you know that your degree is basically all propaganda.
And again, learn to read. The usernames are different.
I don't read usernames. I read content and decide if there is anything that makes any sort of sense. Which this doesn't.
Sounds like a you problem.
Yup. I'm on the phone with your therapist about it.