THE POLICE PROBLEM
The police problem is that police are policed by the police. Cops are accountable only to other cops, which is no accountability at all.
99.9999% of police brutality, corruption, and misconduct is never investigated, never punished, never makes the news, so it's not on this page.
When cops are caught breaking the law, they're investigated by other cops. Details are kept quiet, the officers' names are withheld from public knowledge, and what info is eventually released is only what police choose to release — often nothing at all.
When police are fired — which is all too rare — they leave with 'law enforcement experience' and can easily find work in another police department nearby. It's called "Wandering Cops."
When police testify under oath, they lie so frequently that cops themselves have a joking term for it: "testilying." Yet it's almost unheard of for police to be punished or prosecuted for perjury.
Cops can and do get away with lawlessness, because cops protect other cops. If they don't, they aren't cops for long.
The legal doctrine of "qualified immunity" renders police officers invulnerable to lawsuits for almost anything they do. In practice, getting past 'qualified immunity' is so unlikely, it makes headlines when it happens.
All this is a path to a police state.
In a free society, police must always be under serious and skeptical public oversight, with non-cops and non-cronies in charge, issuing genuine punishment when warranted.
Police who break the law must be prosecuted like anyone else, promptly fired if guilty, and barred from ever working in law-enforcement again.
That's the solution.
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Our definition of ‘cops’ is broad, and includes prison guards, probation officers, shitty DAs and judges, etc — anyone who has the authority to fuck over people’s lives, with minimal or no oversight.
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RULES
① Real-life decorum is expected. Please don't say things only a child or a jackass would say in person.
② If you're here to support the police, you're trolling. Please exercise your right to remain silent.
③ Saying ~~cops~~ ANYONE should be killed lowers the IQ in any conversation. They're about killing people; we're not.
④ Please don't dox or post calls for harassment, vigilantism, tar & feather attacks, etc.
Please also abide by the instance rules.
It you've been banned but don't know why, check the moderator's log. If you feel you didn't deserve it, hey, I'm new at this and maybe you're right. Send a cordial PM, for a second chance.
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ALLIES
• r/ACAB
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INFO
• A demonstrator's guide to understanding riot munitions
• Cops aren't supposed to be smart
• Killings by law enforcement in Canada
• Killings by law enforcement in the United Kingdom
• Killings by law enforcement in the United States
• Know your rights: Filming the police
• Three words. 70 cases. The tragic history of 'I can’t breathe' (as of 2020)
• Police aren't primarily about helping you or solving crimes.
• Police lie under oath, a lot
• Police spin: An object lesson in Copspeak
• Police unions and arbitrators keep abusive cops on the street
• Shielded from Justice: Police Brutality and Accountability in the United States
• When the police knock on your door
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ORGANIZATIONS
• NAACP
• National Police Accountability Project
• Vera: Ending Mass Incarceration
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@MacNCheezus@lemmy.today you have previously stated that “the majority of [people arrested by ICE] do have a criminal history”. Do you still stand by that statement?
First of all, that was like, what? 2-3 months ago? Sorry, I haven't been keeping tabs on the situation since then but I'm definitely not above changing my opinion if I see that the facts have changed.
Second, a single incident like this one doesn't skew the overall statistics much – as long as it remains isolated. THAT DOES NOT MEAN I AGREE WITH WHAT THEY DID HERE. If the facts are correct and she is a U.S. citizen, I hope she sues for damages and wins. At the very least she should be compensated for the damage to her car, plus the emotional trauma, physical injuries (if there were any), and any time she may have missed at work.
ICE was clearly at fault here, and they should be held accountable for that. They are supposed to be working FOR U.S. citizens after all, not against them.
How would you know if people being detained have committed a crime when ICE and the government are not allowing those people due process? What happened to being 'presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law?'
Fun fact: you can't sue CBP or ICE for civil rights violations. Federal law enforcement is immune from suit. The federal law established to let people sue individual state actors for civil rights violation in a federal court doesn't include federal actors.
42 USC §1983:
The facts haven't changed since then. This isn't an isolated incident. This has been going on regularly across the country. This is what ICE's role under trump has been since day 1. This was happening 2-3 months ago. The only thing that changed is that they recently ramped up their budget.
Thank you for your honest reply. If this was an isolated incident, why did the goons feel safe and justified immediately pointing live firearms at someone they already knew was innocent? And why did the people who hired them immediately double down with false statements about the incident that contradict reality? Perhaps the issue is systemic? Can you describe how the combination of the actions of these goons and their bosses later is “for US citizens” when there was literally no way for the goons to know the citizenship status of someone they just blatantly crashed their car into?
Yeah, that's a good point. She probably didn't have her passport on her, that's likely why they took her into custody and then let her go after verifying her status. But like, this probably wouldn't have happened with the regular police, they would've just radioed in her DL# and had the station confirm her status without her even having to get out of her car (actually, most have a laptop in their car and can probably even do it right at the scene).
As for why they acted this way, I can only assume that it is because they are running on a LOT of adrenaline, since they often are doing high stakes operations, so perhaps their nerves just got the better of them. Still, they definitely how her restitution and an apology. But yeah, if this becomes the norm rather than the exception, something should definitely be done to reign them back in.
They didn't take long enough to get any information from her. They surrounded her with weapons drawn, opened the door, and dragged her out. I didn't see them asking for ID. Also, nobody is expected to carry a passport. That insane.
You're trying to come up with excuses. I get it. It's hard to admit you were wrong. However, your previous opinions don't define you as a person. Dismissing them is fine. It only makes you stronger. A lot of people, especially now, attach who they are as a person to the opinions that they hold, and they feel attacked when asked to address it. You shouldn't feel this way though. That doesn't define you. You're allowed to, and should be expected to, learn and change as you gain new knowledge.
Hey, quick question, honest question. How heavy are those goalposts? I figure you'd be the one to ask since you have some experience in moving them.
Wut? Most citizens don't carry their passports around in their home country.
Yes, that's what I was saying (though I guess if you're Hispanic-looking and you live in a hot spot for ICE operations, it might be a pretty good idea to carry with you just in case).
Dude!
Can you still feel yourself?
Oh yes, land of the free! Carry your papers or else something bad might happen.
What if they declare your passport fake like real IDs?
Did you actually read the article?
Forget the passport. Apparently it’s that easy.
Who's paying for the vehicle damage?
What happens when the victim is late for work?
That doesn't sound easy all.
I am a US citizen, and I don't have a passport. I'm white, so I don't have anything to worry about. I have an adopted sister who is Hispanic though, and she doesn't have one either. I've been trying to convince her to get one and keep it on her person.
We live in a red state, so we're not an ICE hot spot like Chicago is. But they are still around. They are everywhere.
If she gets arrested and released, that would be bad. But how many people are being disappeared to foreign countries they aren't even from? That's my biggest fear
Valid fear. Though, I suspect that if that is happening, it likely doesn't matter if she's legal or not. She's still brown. Which is clearly the criteria they're working with.
And just so we're clear, I'm NOT defending their actions. I'm just defining how they think. I happen to think how they think is disgusting.
Is this also protecting US citizens? https://lemmy.world/post/38281052
I’d wager they think yes because “muh gunz”