this post was submitted on 02 Nov 2025
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As expected we are going to sacrifice all for increasing the military budget to please Trump and Nato spending
As part of NATO we have made committments to our partner countries in a mutual defense pact. During the long relative peace, we could get away with underfunding our military because there was no threat on the radar. If you haven't noticed, Russia's got a wartime economy and is marching west and our partners in Europe know the terrible risks brewing.
As far as Trump goes, he is THE major reason for the proposed hikes in NATO spending from 2% to 5. Americans are no longer trustworthy defense or trade partners. NATO was configured for a Pax Americana. Now NATO needs to stand on it's own and that includes removing them as a supplier of choice in equipment. The US is effectively a rogue state without the rule of law and can NOT be counted on as a credible part of NATO.
I am for defending Ukraine but not in expense of Canadians. Canadian shouldn't see all it's services and social programs get downhill for a non eminent threat to Canada
That's short term thinking. I totally get where you're coming from, but the world has let Russia get away with too much already. They need to be stopped or it's going to be so so so much more painful for all of us than the funding cuts we're talking about. If Ukraine falls we won't have a war on our doorstep tomorrow, but it's a domino that will destabilize the peace we prosper from and may very well bring about the next big war. Clearly that's bad for Canada.
Too often we find ourselves in these zero sum mindsets. If we do X we could have been investing in our own Y. We can and should do both. We don't need to drag Canada into the war and start converting our automotive plants into tank factories, that's way too far, but we do need to pay our fair share (the amount we agreed to if not more) to make sure that we keep this era of peace alive. It's the right thing to do, and it's good for Canada in the long run too.
The world is a complicated place with lots of things going on simultaneously. We have to be able to tackle multiple issues at the same time. If the Liberals are saying we need to cut our social programs to fund the military, then say fuck no, fund the military AND the social programs. Tax the wealthy more, nationalize an industry that has gotten too fat, find a way to bring in money not at the cost of citizens. If we have to cinch our belts a little in the short term so be it, but it's not my preference and we shouldn't let our politicians give us these binary options.
That's what I meant . I'm not saying do not spend on the military and defense. I'm saying do not sacrifice other things for it which Carney is doing.
The NPD is the only one who support that. The libs will never do it
You don't seem to have a firm grasp of mutual defense pacts like NATO. Our NATO spending commitments have nothing to do with Ukraine and everything about defending ourselves and our NATO partners from a clear and present danger (Russia) and an evolving threat (US going rogue/insanely stupid).
Poland has good reason to fear Russia and war is on their doorstep. As a member of NATO, their fears are our fears.
Poland has a good reason to fear Russia , Putin want the take back territory that was part of URSS. Canada doesn't.
I want a reformed NATO completely out of the USA control and where each country should estimate how much they should spend. There is no reason for Canada to spend as much as Poland . I'm sorry the USA invading us is not eminent and not probable. There is no reason to sacrifice all our services and social program for it.
The real risk is the USA harming us economically and we are not doing enough to offset that
You have zero understanding of mutual defence pacts. If I were a Russian troll, I would say exactly what you are.
If I was pro Russia I would oppose NATO completely but I don't I think we should stay in it and contribute but not on the expense of Canadian. There is zero reason again to spend as much as a country like Poland
I think it is you who don't understand mutual defense pact because Canadian will not benefit at all from them. It's the countries that have serious risk of being invaded by Russia that will benefits from it
You also have no sense of geopolitics, or good judgement in any way whatsoever.
Look who’s talking. The one who believes we should sacrifice social programs and cut services for an unproven threat. All I’m saying is that yes, we should spend on the military and NATO, but not irresponsibly.
I suggest the rich should pay to protect what made them so. However what you suggest is ridiculously childlike and inneffective.
Be sure to ask your conquerer for lovely social programs.
Your imaginary conqueror. You are completely blinded by unjustifiable fear
Shhh. Grown ups are talking.
You are delusional
You aren't even worth explaining anything to. You have strong opinions despite zero knowledge of I.R., Game Theory or Geopolitics. A complete lack of curiosity or understanding. Read books. We are done here.
You are just a pretentious person who read someone saying we should spend on army responsibly so we don't sacrifice other stuffs and you say nah fuck that let Canadians suffer for an irrational fear
I'd be fine with that if we were simply spending that money entirely within Canada. Invest in some infrastructure. Give me a new job building military death robots, at this point I don't care as long as I get paid. I'll work 16 hours a day building military death robots or winding rotors for drone motors for the national defense as long as it pays me enough to put a roof over my head and food on my table. This should not be a large ask. If we're going to build affordable housing like we did in wartime and invest in defense like we're already at war we may as well have a wartime economy to go with it. Break out the fucking food rations and government workhouses already.
But instead we let costs of living spiral wildly out of control and pretend inflation isn't exploding because the only thing in the consumer price index which isn't skyrocketing is the over-represented falling price of gas, which people aren't using as much of anymore due to WFH and EVs. Then we blow our entire budget of countless billions of dollars on other countries' designs and intellectual property and partnerships where they do all the skilled and value-added work and then we end up employing 1,000 people here if we're lucky, while we have to ask permission to fix it and pay them to train us how to use it.
Yeah, it's our own damn fault for cancelling, selling, giving away, or letting other countries sabotage any of our designs or intellectual property of value and letting our infrastructure for building any of it rot to dust for at least half a century, and there's no easy way back from that. I get it. But knowing that doesn't make it any less infuriating.