this post was submitted on 18 Aug 2025
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Liberal Gun Owners

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[–] corroded@lemmy.world 33 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I think you're missing the point. The vast majority of gun owners will never have to use their firearms in self-defense, that much is true. Most responsible gun owners also hope they never have to. It's also true that the vast majority of people with homeowners insurance will never have their house burn down, yet they still pay their insurance company every month.

Wouldn't you at least like to give yourself a fighting chance in the event that the worst happens?

[–] frezik@lemmy.blahaj.zone 35 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Just to expand on that, there's value in just having them. The US military has developed anti-insurgent tactics over the past 20 years. One of them is that to occupy an armed populace, they expect to need one soldier for every three civilians in the area. They have to assume everyone is armed and everyone will be against them.

That would mean that if they want to put the US under martial law, they will need to mobilize 25% of the US population into the military directly and expect them to follow orders to the same level of competence as the existing military. This is a pipe dream. Approximately 10% of the US population was uniformed up in WW2, and agreement on the war was nearly universal. The draft existed not so much to get enough people, but to make sure the military could take in people at a sustainable rate without cutting too much into industrial production at home.

All combined, the regular military, the National Guard, and ICE do not have enough people to put the entire country under martial law. They don't even have enough to put New York under martial law. They might have enough for Vermont. The ICE recruiting surge won't change this.

[–] GraniteM@lemmy.world 23 points 1 week ago

They might have enough for Vermont.

The Green Mountain Boys, the long-standing Vermont secessionist movement, and a bunch of deer-hunting farmers with generations of familiarity with the land and a massive "mind your own goddamn business" attitude have entered the chat.

[–] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)

They might have enough for Vermont.

You'd think that, if you didn't know Vermont. Mass is the state you want, they have no guns, like for real. VT is liberal NH, they have plenty guns. Hell they might have an easier time with NY than VT tbh, even with the disparity in numbers between them and VT.

[–] frongt@lemmy.zip 4 points 6 days ago (1 children)

MA has a nonzero amount of guns.

[–] ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 6 days ago

I know they have a literal few, but fuck they fight hard to cut down on it. You'd think with all the goddamn bricks in that trail it'd remind them freedom was a thing but NOPE.

Still have family in the state. Know it well.