UK Politics

4113 readers

128 users here now

General Discussion for politics in the UK.
Please don't post to both !uk_politics@feddit.uk and !unitedkingdom@feddit.uk .
Pick the most appropriate, and put it there.

Posts should be related to UK-centric politics, and should be either a link to a reputable news source for news, or a text post on this community.

Opinion pieces are also allowed, provided they are not misleading/misrepresented/drivel, and have proper sources.

If you think "reputable news source" needs some definition, by all means start a meta thread. (These things should be publicly discussed)

Posts should be manually submitted, not by bot. Link titles should not be editorialised.

Disappointing comments will generally be left to fester in ratio, outright horrible comments will be removed.
Message the mods if you feel something really should be removed, or if a user seems to have a pattern of awful comments.

founded 2 years ago

MODERATORS

tom@feddit.uk

GreatAlbatross@feddit.uk

flamingos@feddit.uk

frankPodmore@slrpnk.net

‘The place is empty, a lot have left’: Ballymena weighs up impact of anti-migrant riots (www.theguardian.com)

submitted 2 weeks ago by FelixCress@lemmy.world to c/uk_politics@feddit.uk

38 comments fedilink hide all child comments

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments

[–] flamingos@feddit.uk 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Are you seriously defending a pogrom? And to preempt your 'but I said violence is bad' response, you're still defending the logic of pogrom, that it's OK to paint an ethnic minority by the actions of its worst. The absurdity to suggest that these people had 'valid concerns' and weren't just racists who already hated the Roma and are using thinly veiled excuses to do what they always wanted, ethnic cleansing.

[–] Flax_vert@feddit.uk 2 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

No. I'm saying the government should do something about crime to prevent people from resorting to violence in the future. The violence wasn't okay, but something should still be done to stop it from happening again instead of just dismissing it as "racism"

weren't just racists who already hated the Roma and are using thinly veiled excuses to do what they always wanted, ethnic cleansing.

I heavily doubt that's the full story. Especially since I know people who live in Ballymena and they've said that there were problems, even talking about it long before it happened. I don't think everyone in Ballymena are racists making stuff up.

In fact, how do I know that you're not being prejudiced against people from Ballymena by just assuming that they are all racist? There is a pattern to these comments such as "Unionist racism" and a media narrative somehow that the Ulster Scots people - who are a national minority themselves - are mainly a bunch of racist bigots. Which couldn't be further from the truth.

But once again, I cannot stress enough that I do not defend this. But our takeaway from this should be that communities need to be developed more, not just "them racists at it again"

What I am actually saying is that this should be framed as an anti social behaviour problem. Not a race problem - and by all sides, the people complaining about it as well. In many places there are similar problems but with white British or white Irish kids. And when someone does something about it, it scarcely makes national headlines.

[–] flamingos@feddit.uk 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

In fact, how do I know that you’re not being prejudiced against people from Ballymena by just assuming that they are all racist? There is a pattern to these comments such as “Unionist racism” and a media narrative somehow that the Ulster Scots people - who are a national minority themselves - are mainly a bunch of racist bigots. Which couldn’t be further from the truth.

Fuck off, calling a bunch of people celebrating the 'amazing atmosphere' after getting rid an ethnic minority racist is clearly not racist in and of itself. God, this so typical of you and your privilege. We shouldn't analyze a literal pogrom through the lens of race, but calling people who did one racist is actually the real racism because Unionist is being used a dog whistle for Ulster Scots or something.

But once again, I cannot stress enough that I do not defend this. But our takeaway from this should be that communities need to be developed more, not just “them racists at it again”

You don't develop from ethnic cleansing by digging your head in the sand and ignoring the uncomfortable truth that there is something deeply wrong.

And no, these people weren't 'concerned' about the anti-social behaviour of the local Roma community (how you don't see the problem with this framing but do bristle at Unionist being tarred as racists is baffling), they wanted to do a pogrom:

There, some people directly pointed the finger at the Roma community, calling the town “Rommena” (a portmanteau of Romania and Ballymena) with one person claiming that certain places were “a no-go area now if you’re not a Roma or Bulgarian”.

Several people called for violence, commenting things like “Time there was a good clean out”, “[It's] about time the town was cleansed”, “Remove the rats” and “Time to take our town back”.

[–] Flax_vert@feddit.uk 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Thank you for that second source. It's much more enlightening from how the Guardian framed it.

My point was more about things needed to be done by officials about anti social behaviour - as it can fuel racism. While that still stands, from the comments shown on The Journal, it shows that racism was clearly a factor. More than I had originally estimated.

I would also say though:

After thousands of people gathered in the town to demonstrate about women’s safety, their concerns were weaponised by a smaller, more violent group who used the protest as an excuse to take aim at the wider immigrant population.

That original group about safety shouldn't be categorised with a brush about racism

[–] FelixCress@lemmy.world 1 points 1 week ago (1 children)

how the Guardian framed it.

You mean the Guardian showed racist cunts as racist cunts by quoting their own words?

[–] Flax_vert@feddit.uk 0 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

The guardian made it seem like there was a pre-existing problem. Although several people I know from Ballymena did corroborate that there have been issues from individuals from that part of the community. I know a shopkeeper who had to refuse entry to them, alleging that they were always stealing things or trying to scam the shop. My impression from the guardian article was that such issues have calmed down since the riots, showing that there was a failure of law enforcement to keep the area in check beforehand.

[–] FelixCress@lemmy.world 0 points 1 week ago (1 children)

No. The Guardian showed that racist cunts had a problem with foreigners and racist cunts were happy when they ethnically cleansed them.