this post was submitted on 22 Apr 2025
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[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago (9 children)

It might be a no-brainer if it was all "We are making orphan crushers for the orphans", but the defense industry is much more complex than that. For example, would you say that a Ukrainian working for a Ukrainian defense firm, whose sole purpose is to develop weapons for killing people, is evil?

[–] Comrade_Spood@slrpnk.net 17 points 4 months ago (7 children)

I do think there is nuance to the situation and exceptions. Your example being one. But I would consider Lockheed (the example of the original post) would be the no brainer one. Those weapons aren't going to defending my family from an imperialist power, they are going to death squads in South America and committing genocide in Palestine.

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 9 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (6 children)

I do think there is nuance to the situation and exceptions. Your example being one. But I would consider Lockheed (the example of the original post) would be the no brainer one. Those weapons aren’t going to defending my family from an imperialist power, they are going to death squads in South America and committing genocide in Palestine.

But Lockheed-Martin's equipment is going to Ukraine as well. Are the families of Ukrainians not worth defending? And 'death squads' in South America are not particularly likely to be using state-of-the-art US jets and missiles for their murders. And considering the state of things in Taiwan and Europe, if the US doesn't end up on the side of the imperialist powers, I don't know how much I would bet that Lockheed-Martin weapons won't be defending other families from imperialist powers in the near the future,

Considering the strict controls on defense exports, it is far more relevant to question who the US government chooses (directly or indirectly) to support with Lockheed-Martin's output. When the US is against genocide, as in Ukraine, Lockheed-Martin's output is used to save innocent lives; when the US is for genocide, as in Palestine, Lockheed-Martin's output is used for murder. Though even then I would note that it's not particularly pivotal to the murders committed.

The correct target for ire in this, other than perhaps capitalism in general for creating a significant disconnect between social responsibility and firms of all industries, is the US government and where it funnels this equipment. The firms themselves are amoral but unexceptional, both in consequences and in nature; and the people who work at them (other than at the highest decision-making levels) are no more immoral than any other cog in the capitalist machine.

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

But Lockheed-Martin’s equipment is going to Ukraine as well.

Yes the MIC fuels war and death everywhere. They're profiteers, not heroes. Do you celebrate the weapons sold to russia as well? It's all the same capitalists profiting.

When the US is against genocide, as in Ukraine,

The USA is not against genocide in Ukraine. Imperialism is a direct cause of the genocide. Grow up.

The firms themselves are amoral

jfc. Is Elmo amoral? Is Bezos amoral? And you think the MIC is somehow amoral? How much corporate propaganda have you been drinking?

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