this post was submitted on 15 Aug 2024
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Symbols have more than one meaning… The word “fascism” comes from one of these symbols: the Fasces. However the fasces are still used by France:
Or by the US:
Are these countries fascists just because they use the Fasces? Of course not. They have other meanings. It's the same with this Ukrainian symbol.
The difference is that at the time the fasces were adopted they didn't mean fascism. But also, coincidentally, the US and France are fascist.
And the tryzub didn't mean fascism when it was firstly adopted by the (menchevik communist) Ukrainian People's Republic in 1917…
Okay but it did mean fascism after ww2. You know, after nazi collaborators participated in the holocaust in Ukraine, killing Ukrainian Jewish folks and others.
I dont think the original Ukrainian republic in 1917 was fascist though, we agree there.
Vichy France of Pétain participated in the Holocaust too. France still use the fasces, the same anthem and the same flag.
Well, hot take /s, France bad
That's not the point. The point is: Ukraine is a normal country, nor a fascist hellhole nor a perfect Paradise. Their national symbol is also used by its far right, today and during the WWII; just like all other countries under the Nazi rule in Europe. And just like all other countries under the Nazi rule in Europe, they continued to use their national symbols after the WWII.
The point I was making is that France is also a fascist hellhole.
You have no idea of what fascism is.
I have literally dedicated years of my life to a thorough understanding of German fascism, I know what fascism is. France is ideologically fascist and transitioning to it economically.
You follow the tankie definition of fascism? “Everything at the right of the bolshevism is fascism”?
No, I am able to distinguish between less informed socialists, social democrats, anarchists/libertarians, liberals, and fascists, thank you.
Vichy France bad
Mhmm. And you have to look at what France does to immigrants right now
We don't gas them, so it's not as bad. But yeah it's still not great
I mean, you don't have to gas people to be fascist, look at the US
Well USA do gas people all the time on protests and cop raids. They even used real deal Zyklon B to fumigate immigrants at border prior to WW2 (both theoretically non lethal doses though afaik some people did died or had other health problems) there was also over 600 executions in gas chamber.
Tear gas is bad not equivalent to gassing in the concentration camp sense. The US has stopped using Zyklon B and is still fascist.
Yeah, they killed much more people even without gas.