Ukraine

This clip is a good metaphor for this stage of the war. Turtle tanks are two things 1.) A distraction meant to keep the international narrative that Russia is winning with superior strength dominant for as long as possible before it utterly falls apart from the opposite reality becoming apparent. 2.) A genuine delusion/expression of desperation in Russian armor design/doctrine. Independent of the threat drones pose, the idea of fielding a massive turtle tank with a HUGE profile, low visibility/battlefield awareness, poor maneuverability and essentially no reverse gear to speak of is absurd when Ukraine has access to semi-modern western main battle tanks.

This is how you are supposed to use a tank. Imagining a semi-trained Abrams crew engaging a Russian turtle "tank" is like imagining a semi-professional adult baseball team playing a baseball game against a kids little league team. In otherwords it would be funny how badly mismatched this matchup was if it we weren't talking about war where people are dying to defend Ukraine.

A single semi-modern western main battle tank working with combined arms and UAV surveillance/FPV attack drone support can destroy a mountain of these Russian turtle "tanks". The numbers become meaningless because the matchup is so uneven, or rather one side has refused to actually evolve and is relying on propaganda/delaying distractions with wild battlefield strategies that nobody tries anymore for good reason because they are obsolete. Slapping a new coat of "but DRONES AND AI!" on top of a careless throwing away of an incomprehensible amount of human life doesn't really change what is going on here fundamentally.

This video is a great demonstration of that, the Russian turtle tank stood essentially no chance against the Ukrainian tank crew so long as the Ukrainian tank crew kept their cool and remained in constant communication with reconassaince and surveillance friendly assets in the area.

Maybe Russia will decide horses are the best way to defeat drones next? Do you think western tech media will do hype pieces about how western main battle tanks are now actually obsolete and Russia is smart for switching to only horses for its cavalry? Wired will do some breathless piece about how genius the Russians are for realizing that using electrified motorbikes and golf carts gives them an electronic signature and that *horses are far more stealthy (donkeys, Russia only actually has a couple of horses and relies mostly on tactical donkeys). Elon MUsk will market a new Tesla CYBERHORSE which is just a horse with carboard horse armor spray painted silver.

sigh

I linked to the reddit post because I couldn't figure out how to link to video/figured I'd give context.

It is shocking and embarassing how hopeless the feeble rare armored assaults have become for Russia.

https://t.me/marmuletik/39968

https://t.me/soniah_hub/11599

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Загальні бойові втрати противника з 24.02.22 по 27.07.25 (орієнтовно)

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also see

https://www.reuters.com/world/russias-spy-agency-says-serbia-sold-ammunition-ukraine-via-bulgaria-czech-2025-06-23/

https://balkaninsight.com/2025/07/23/destination-ukraine-risking-russian-ire-serbia-clears-transit-of-bosnian-ammo/

According to Bosnian media outlet Klix.ba, the Czech Republic imported more than 30,000 artillery shells from Pretis. Though Pretis is majority-owned by the Bosnian state, US arms firm Regulus Global, which has procured arms and ammunition for Ukraine and previously Syria, holds a 41.5 per cent stake through an offshore company and recently proposed a $100 million upgrade of the company.

Regulus also owns 25.7 per cent of shares in another Bosnian arms manufacturer called Binas d.d, with Regulus CEO Joe Wallis telling Al Jazeera Balkans in July: “We see the chance to build something that serves both the European defence needs and also helps economic growth in Bosnia and Herzegovina.”

With Russia’s war in Ukraine, Wallis said artillery “is back in the centre” of modern warfare.

...

Regulus says it has delivered “more than 100,000” 155mm artillery shells to Ukraine, though it is embroiled in a court dispute in London over a $1.7 billion contract to sell such shells to the Ukrainian government, the FT reported in May.

[Mirror](

In Stavropol, drones struck the “Signal” radio electronics plant.

The facility specializes in the development and production of special-purpose radio-electronic equipment, including for aviation and electronic warfare (EW). The plant is under international sanctions.

Plan “Kovyor” was activated at the airports of Vladikavkaz and Grozny.

UPD: SSU drones targeted the production facilities of the Stavropol Radio Plant “Signal.” The plant manufactures various types of EW systems, radar and radionavigation equipment, and remote-control radio systems — all for the Russian military-industrial complex.

One of the strikes hit Building No. 2 (Workshop No. 5), which houses expensive imported CNC (computer numerical control) machines.

The second strike was recorded in Building No. 1, where Radio-Electronic Device Workshop No. 17 is located.

https://t.me/ssternenko/46973

October 28, 2019. After several months in office, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy arrived at NABU to address detectives:

"The main question, why I came to you with my colleagues, is to charge you with this energy, so that you understand: we will not and do not want to influence you, but we really want, as people who represent society, I, as the elected president, really want you to know that your hands are not tied. Please, we really want all top corrupt officials to really receive deserved sentences. Because society will never forgive us for this."

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Recognizing this window of opportunity and the vulnerability of the Russians, Ukrainian forces acted decisively. With Russian reserves either dead in the fields or stationed too far to provide timely reinforcements, Ukraine pressed its advantage, launching coordinated air, drone, and HIMARS missile strikes against known Russian troop concentrations in Kindrativka. Ukrainian drones methodically hunted down and eliminated Russian infantry clusters, while precise HIMARS strikes obliterated remaining fortifications and munitions stores with devastating effect. Airstrikes with AASM Hammer bombs ensured no immediate reinforcements could move forward safely, effectively neutralizing major resistance within Kindrativka itself and limiting the possibility of surviving Russian troops finding cover within the ruins.

This is what decisively losing a war sounds like.

Notice, no matter what Russia claims about how warfare is changed and they don't need armor just dirtbikes and atvs... the reason this counterattack was so costly for Russia was precisely because the infantry essentially had no access to transportation they could safely use in groups to quickly reposition to counter Ukrainian maneuvers. This is why mechanization is such an advantage in modern warfare and how it is almost shocking the degree to which Russia seems to be ignoring that reality.

Ukraine significantly disrupted Russian logistics and troop rotations, effectively sabotaging Russia’s goal of establishing drone and artillery fire control over the regional capital, Sumy.

I don't see how adding more foreign troops who probably haven't even trained with the random Russian troops they are being thrown together with into this mix is going to change things, 30,000 soldiers from any nation is nothing to dismiss especially from a nation with a large military like North Korea but I don't think it really changes the calculus. I especially don't think Russia's foreign allies are going to be happy when images and video of their long range expensive artillery systems getting repeatedly annihilated by Ukrainian drones and counter battery fire goes viral on the internet...

If Putin does not back down and agree to some sort of exit or ceasefire from this war we can only hope that Ukraine can continue to exploit this severe limitation to the Russian military in order to encircle large numbers of troops and get them to surrender without countless Ukrainians having to die in an endless battle of head on attrition that has so far typified most of the war.

The article seems to have kind of a negative bias to it that I don't quite understand?

Here is the Telegraph link

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2025/07/25/full-untold-story-donald-trump-u-turn-ukraine-war-us-russia/

While I think think the focus on the Patriot missiles is somewhat distracting from more crucial weapon systems like the ones I have posted in this community (155mm ammunition and artillery, HIMARS, EW/jamming/anti-drone turboprop aircraft etc...) I can absolutely see the crucial importance of these systems getting delivered.

The reason is not that Patriot missiles are necessary for the defense of the bulk population of Ukraine, it is they make it much harder for Russia to use an extremely expensive weapons system to take out a very high value civilian or military target at a crucial moment. A patriot missile defense system provides the first step of confidence to employ a whole host of other more cost effective short range and high ammunition air defense systems to counter the Russian attack on Ukrainian civilians at a mass scale.

Note however, this is not how the people selling the Patriot missile systems are going to sell it to the governments and militaries purchasing them. I invoke this as apolitically as possible but notice that with Israel's near infinite backing of US military support it never really bothered to develop air defense systems such as the Sky Sentinel, technologies Ukraine immediately understood the necessity of.

The reason isn't that Israelis are less intelligent than Ukrainians, rather it is that the US/western military industrial complex in its aid to Israel for obvious reasons favored the most expensive counters to Iranian threats they could possibly get away with. F35s, absurdly expensive missiles and other technologies certainly have their place in a wholistic air/missile defense and I am sure the air defense strategy of Israel will serve as a future blueprint for many countries but this type of extremely high cost per use air defense system is in no way sufficient to protect a civilian population at large and it wasn't really designed to...

We must ensure the whole rest of the Ukrainian air defense system is also supported, otherwise Ukraine will simply be forced to fire all the patriot missiles it gets and will run out... and then there will be 99 patriot missiles in reserve on the wall globally, rinse repeat.

One could argue that one of the Russian win conditions of the war in Ukraine must be to exhaustively deplete "western" stocks of Patriot missiles in the medium term. If Russia cannot ensure that it cannot win the Ukraine war at least in the medium term.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/M142_HIMARS

The HIMARS weapon system is probably the most pivotal weapon in the defense of Ukraine behind drones (a distant second, but second nonetheless) and artillery. Why? The reasons aren't necessarily obvious at first, with so many different types of advanced unmanned drone weapon systems what does a rocket fired out of big clunky truck/tank really do to radically change the strategic balance of land warfare in the region?

The answer to that question is among one of the most pressing lessons that the world, especially Europe must learn. Ukraine already learned it awhile ago, that is why they are always asking for more HIMARS missiles...

To explain why this weapon system is so crucial, I think this recent bit of news actually helps explain it best. The US Army is replacing 14 howitizers stationed on Hawaii for defense with HIMARS weapon systems.

https://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/articles/2025/7/15/just-in-army-replacing-howitzers-with-himars-in-indopacific-division

Consider the problem as an army (not a navy or air force) detachment charged with defending Hawaii from a possible invasion. Artillery/howitizers are still crucial as they are anywhere else... but their range tops out at maybe 50km with specialized ammunition. Consider the size and scale of the Hawaiian Islands.

The range of a HIMARS system on the otherhand is approaching 500km/300 miles, and you can immediately see how much more useful even a much smaller number of HIMARS systems and ammunition would be for an army detachment defending the Hawaiian island chain than almost any number of traditional howitizer cannons.

It is this scale that the HIMARS system dominates at, and the same logic of choosing a HIMARS system in a situation like the US army faces in constructing a defense of Hawaii applies to a highly contested near peer landwar like Ukraine where the closer you get to the front the more lethal things become.

In otherwords, using HIMARS systems to reach out and strike enemy artillery, radar, anti-air defenses, logistics or other high value targets from the distances HIMARS can fire places the enemy in a situation where all of their forces might as well be stranded on an island with 100km of impossibly fearsome ocean between them and the HIMARS system. You cannot commit your experienced military staff to battle and count on enough of them surviving to continue to effectively fight a war under this kind of consistent, undefendable precision threat.

Traditional tube or cannon artillery is not going anywhere except in unique situations like defending a massive island chain like Hawaii as a ground force, rather the very nature of artillery has been radically changed by the introduction of HIMARS as a new even longer range compliment to shorter range high volume cannon artillery systems. The fact that Russia does not have an effective counter nor even capacity to execute similar strikes at scale makes the likelihood of them making a decisive breakthrough in an offensive this summer remote even with a large advantage in infantry number.