Does anyone have some data on how the win percentage differs depending on play vs draw? I guess it differs highly for aggro and control players with midrange somewhere in between.

Just now on Arena I was playing against a [[Sauron, the Dark Lord]] Historic Brawl deck. I realized that I had lethal, but played the last 1-mana creature in my hand before attacking.

I then realized that I'd just played [[Delighted Halfling]].

Before beating Sauron.

Hi folks. I have recently introduced a couple of friends to MTG. I've played the game for quite a while on and off (started in 2013) and have also played a bit competitively at times (Modern and limited). I've been out of the game for a couple of years and recently got back into it.

I would love to hear from your experiences with introducing new players to the game these days (the product lineup is quite different nowadays) and which formats you have tried in a group with a wide skill and experience gap.

I took one of them to the LTR prerelease and we had a good time. Afterwards we played pack wars with our prize packs and played our sealed decks against each other. We ended upgrading our sealed decks with cards from the packs and also make some extra 40-card decks with our extra LTR cards from the seald pool + prize packs.

We have since played some more with these LTR 40-card decks and it's been a lot of fun. These are the decks we used to introduce another friend to the game yesterday. We have discussed keeping this 40-card LTR format alive and I am consider buying some LTR jumpstart packs as a housewarming gift to the second friend who doesn't have any cards of their own (yet).

I am very cautious about imposing financial pressure on my friends and I try to not spend too much money on cardboard myself. Therefore, no matter what format we end up with, it should obviously be a budget friendly one. I like that the 40-card LTR format is very accessible (at least right now), but I know that it is ultimately a short-lived phenomenon that will become stale and inaccessible once the products leave the shelves. Another downside to going heavily in on LTR as a set is that it doesn't naturally transition to a financially viable 60-card format since most of the cards are only legal in Modern. Opting for current standard sets instead could be a gateway towards Pioneer.

Is then commander the natural next step? I suspect we will get there eventually no matter what, but I also think it's a bit of a big initial hurdle to get a full 100-card deck if you don't really want to spend much money on the game.

I am definitely pro-proxying and have been working on some proxy printing techniques and toying with the idea of handing out "booster packs" of commander staple proxies during our game nights to give everyone access to good cards.

I have also been toying with the idea of making an LTR cube/collection of cards to use for wizard's tower, fat stack, cube draft, premade decks or homemade jumpstart packs which would save everyone else money, but I am wary that my friends will miss out on the glorious experience of acquiring new cards and putting them in your deck which admittedly is quite fun.

I've also considered pauper as it has some event support at my LGS and I've wanted to play it for some time, but I think the main thing holding me back is the fact that it depends a lot on online research and buying old singles from the internet. New players will feel bummed that they don't get to play the new shiny cards from their booster packs and might be daunted by the vast card pool in Pauper.

Perhaps 60-card kitchen table magic could work fine, as well? In that case I would have to figure out some deck retrictions for myself, since my Modern decks would obviously be too strong.

The proxy angle is also something that boggles my mind. I haven't really done much proxying before but I kinda feel that it's not super fun to just grab top tier decks online and proxying them outright. I'm a big believed in the adage "limitation breeds creativity" and the creativity of deck building is such a huge part of the game, I think.

Obviously I'm not going to make a unilateral decision about formats, but I have the most experience and existing card resources so I have a big say in things by choosing which things I want to introduce or suggest to the others.

Just for reference, my LGS also sometimes does French duel Commander, Premodern, Oathbreaker or Highlander casual tournaments. Oathbreaker does seem kinda fun, I guess?

It would've been great if the free peoples of Middle-Earth had been Rakdos-colored and the tyranny of Sauron and Saruman had been based on white mana.

The Lidless Eye is working towards homogeny and stagnation. Kind of a missed opportunity to break from the "black magic is evil" trope 🤷🏻‍♀️ @mtg

I used to say "I sleeved up Flash Wolves" (or w/e deck name) to mean that I've put together and started using a new deck, whether a brew or a netdeck. But I need to find a new phrase now that I am increasingly playing formats where I don't sleeve.

@mtg

Still very early, but black is really performing pretty well for me. There are some really strong and synergistic commons in black. Most notably, [[Mirkwood Bats]] and [[Mordor Trebuchet]] paired with any goblin or amass/orc enablers is just absolutely devastating.

Black has the cleanest and strongest removal, and a lot if is also at common. [[Bitter Downfall]] (Uncommon) and [[Claim the Precious]] are both great, [[Lash of the Balrog]] is not difficult to run.

Other commons like [[Dunland Crebain]] are performing well. [[Gollum's Bite]] hits a lot of targets. And there are a few really efficient combat tricks that effectively double as removal in [[Orcish Medicine]] and the slightly worse [[Shelob's Ambush]].

I think it can be beneficial to take some of these commons early imo but I'm curious what anyone else's thoughts are.

I've got a rules question, because if this works, it's one heck of a flavor win: Can [[Doors of Durin]] bring out [[The Watcher in the Water]] tapped and attacking, or will The Watcher in the Water be unable to attack due to the stun counters?

Am I doing something wrong? It seems to me that we ought to be able to find communities from other instances by searching for them, but I don't really see much when I search. Sometimes some communities show up, but it seems to be only communities I've visited before or something?

In his ongoing "Lessons Learned" series, Mark Rosewater walks through every set for which he’s led or co-led design and talks about what he learned.

Here are his previous three articles:

• Part 1
• Part 2
• Part 3

Last time he got through original Theros and he starts here with Khans of Tarkir.

I won't go into too much detail, but I felt that most people were playing highly synergistic decks with a bunch of value engines that took a while to assemble, either in Abzan or Esper (or 4 color without red). I played Esper colours myself, with a lot of token and sacrifice synergy.

Didn't see anything I would describe as an aggressive deck. All of my matches went to time and I tied two out of three matches. I felt like I was playing essentially mirror matches every match, just with slightly different cards. One table at the event went 30 minutes overtime in the first round. It was the board stall from hell.

Even though the ring-bearer mechanic incentivized attacking, it was usually done to trigger the looting to get more value cards and the board states just kept piling up, despite the format having pretty alright removal, I feel.

I still had fun, but it was a bit draining, I suppose.

Overview of the mechanics, removal spells, and 2-color archetypes.

Problems

Personally I'm pretty unimpressed with the mechanics behind "The Ring Tempts You" in the latest UB set. Lore wise, the One Ring promises great things, but never actually delivers anything other than ruin and the mechanic doesn't deliver on that. While I understand the argument that being a removal magnet is a downside on it's own, I don't really buy into it and at the very least, it's not enough of one on its own. As it stands, The Ring is simply all upside as far as I see it.

Additionally, the allowance of multiple ring-bearers (one for each player at the table) is a huge flavor fail. It's The One Ring, not The "Everyone gets one" Ring. This leads to my resolution of these issues -

Solution

My quick and dirty fix is that the Ring should be a unique effect per game that only one player can hold at a time, and an exchangeable boon like Monarch is, changing sides as the bearer is killed off.

It could still power up like it already does and obviously benefit the player controlling the ring-bearer, but adding the possibility of unwillingly giving that benefit to your opponent is very in line with The Ring lore-wise. This would also add some practicality to killing the ring-bearer instead of just removing the biggest threat on the board, which is the de-facto play in any game of Magic.

As I said, I am no game designer so I'm probably overlooking things, but I feel like this would work much better than the mechanic that we got. And while I obviously don't foresee any errata's coming from WotC for this, if I do play with LTR casually in paper, I'd probably suggest this fix as an improvement over the rules as written.

What do y'all think? Would this be an improvement? Or do you think the mechanic is better as-is?

Apologies if this is the wrong place to post this.

If I have a Hardened Scales and an Ozolith, the Shattered Spire on the battlefield and I cast a spell that causes a creature to get a +1/+1 counter, do I add a total of three +1/+1 counters to that creature or four?

In other words, do Hardened Scales and Ozolith, the Shattered Spire both see the new +1/+1 counter on the stack simultaneously and add a single additional +1/+1 counter each? Or would (for example) Hardened Scales see the original +1/+1 counter, and add another one to the stack, at which point Ozolith, the Shattered Spire sees the original +1/+1 counter and adds an additional counter to the stack, and then as a separate event sees the +1/+1 counter from Hardened Scales and adds a second additional +1/+1 counter?

If the latter is true, then adding a couple other cards (like a Pir, Imaginative Rascal and Kami of Whispered Hopes) would make this insane. Hardened scales adds 1 additional +1/+1, Ozolith, the Shattered Spire adds 2 more, then Pir adds 3, then Kami of Whispered Hopes adds 4, for a total of 11 (including the original +1/+1 counter).

Nothing is better than getting some big groan-worthy guy for cheap, and the best part is since the grave is public your opponents see it coming!

I've got a Sidisi, Brood Tyrant commander list, and some of my favorites are:

Archon of Cruelty: Classic value dude. Gets you stuff immediately, hits for 6 in the air, and continues to cause problems every turn he's alive. He's usually the best option.

Ancient Brass Dragon: Reanimate a Reanimator! Honestly kinda slow, not to mention inconsistent, but I got the extra large Bauldurs gate d20 and it's just so fun to roll!

Dreadfeast Demon: what if my zombies were demons instead? Obviously requires some work to make sure you have fodder, but even if your entire board gets eaten having a board full of 6/6s with evasion is a pretty good spot to be.

Graaz, Unstoppable Juggernaut: But what if instead of demons, they were Juggernauts?? Transforming everyone as soon as he arrives makes Graaz a big aggro play, and depending on boardstate may take out a player or two on the same turn. I've even had the "can't be blocked by walls" text be relevant (take that fog bank!)

So what are your favorite bigguns to bring back from the dead?

Going to play at a pre release tournament tomorrow, any tips for winning?

I'm still somewhat new to MtG, and have mainly played commander, along with a bit of modern which was a little too intense for me. What are some good formats to look into for kitchen table, 2 player mtg with my wife? Commander is great but tends to want a 4 player format.

Bear in mind we'd rather not buy new cards, but used cards and proxies are fine, got no major price constraints since I'm happy to print up a card if it's going to be too hard to find.

Brand new community and already the content is pouring in, and you've made a card bot too! Y'all are impressive. I feel that with the dedicated folks running this place this community will flourish, and I'll be here to see watch it happen. Cheers

I think it's pretty neat, at least from a commander perspective. Making non-legendary creatures into legendary creatures can add some cool synergies with cards like Ratadrabik of Urborg.

Should there be a 'community' for proxies?

And if it isn't allowed, is this site just shilling for WOTC?

Lord of the Rings: Tales of Middle Earth

I have been looking forward to this set for a very long time. My love for the mighty dwarven race started with reading the Hobbit, and my all-time favorite literary character is Thorin Oakenshield. Sadly, he does not appear in this set but there is hope with maybe some of the secret lairs coming out. However, one of the most exciting aspects about this set for Dwarves is that not only does it have some iconic dwarves from LotR, it also finally gives tools for the new dwarven tribal deck that was teased with [[Lady of Otaria]].

When looking at the cards, I will mostly be referencing Explorer/Pioneer, Historic and Commander decks that utilize Dwarf tribal. The decks I typically use are:

1. [[Depala, Pilot Exemplar]] RW deck - The original Dwarf Lord that actually cares about dwarves. She also cares about vehicles and with Magda on her team she can pack quite a punch.

2. [[Magda Brazen Outlaw]] R deck – This deck likes to turn dwarves sideway for treasure, then sacking that treasure for a game changing dragon or artifact.

3. Boros Equipment/Auras,- Dwarves actually have quite a few cards that work with this strategy, [[Bruenor Battlehammer]], [[Koll the Forge Master]], and [[Reyav, Master Smith]].

4. [[Torbran Thane of Red Fell]] R Deck – Basically put the best burn spells and damage causing spells you can and the best dwarves (and maybe a few Dragons) you can get. Extra combat steps and double strike are nice too.

5. [[Lady of Otaria]] RG Deck – Recently introduced. Basically, somehow sacrifice lands and get dwarves into your hand. I have a deck, but it is still a work in progress. Anyone else build a deck with her yet?

White:

[[Flowering of the White Tree]] I really like this card for Depala and Bruenor decks, pumping all your dwarves and giving all legendries Ward 1 seems pretty good for the creature-based decks.

[[Forge Anew]] Okay this card is a must include in any Bruenor and Reyav decks. I mean it does everything, gets back dead equipment, lets you equip at instant speed and let you pay 0 for the first equip cost of your turn. I really like this card!

[[Reprieve]] Kind of a temporary Counter in white and draw a card, I could see this being quite fun and useful in any of the Boros decks I really want to try this out.

Red

[[Erebor Flamesmith]] Yes, this dwarf is made for a Torbran deck! Possibly 3 damage for every instant or sorcery which in all likely hood is another burn spell! Yeah fun times!

[[Fear, Fire Foes!]] A really nice potential board wipe for a Torbran deck, definitely worth trying out.

[[Fiery Inscription]] Another card for Torbran, and also has the Ring Tempts you. Not sure how relevant the Rings Tempts you will be for Torbran or Dwarves in general.

[[Gimli, Counter of Kills]] Okay our First Gimli card! And he slots in nicely with Torbran, and he has trample, which I love to see on my dwarves. I know a lot of people were thinking it was a missed opportunity to have this card being able to partner with the Legolas counter of kills card and I would have to agree. That would have been pretty cool.

[[Gimli’s Axe]] Okay, now here is my first real gripe of the set. All of the other free peoples, human, halfling, and elf, get a weapon with a reduced equip cost for there race. Why not this card for Dwarves? I mean it’s Gimli’s axe! I mean its an okay common and I will definitely throw it in my commander dwarf equipment decks for flavor alone but really!!! I kind of just seems the dwarves getting the shaft here for no real reason.

[[Gimli’s Fury]] A two mana pump spell that give you +3/+2 and trample? And is called Gimli’s Fury? Yes, you had me at Gimli’s fury. Okay so you play this mostly for flavor, but in all seriousness, swinging in with a loaded up on equipment dwarf, if you give it trample it can be game over for someone.

[[Gloin, Dwarf Emissary]] Gloin! Ah yes, one of the original 14 members of Thorin’s Company! And this, along with the other Gimli for the Commander precons are probably the best new dwarves for Dwarf Tribal. First of all you make a treasure when you cast an historic spell for the first time each turn. Yes! Very nice, Both the Boros equipment dwarves and Magda have lots of artifacts. Also, I love the Goad for the Boros equipment decks as you can have those pesky potential blockers attack either you or someone else (if playing commander) and then have free access to swing in with our massive supped up dwarf. And of course Magda just really loves treasure.

[[There and Back Again]] 14 treasures!! 14 treasures, what Magda can do with 14 treasures. I love the flavor and the fact that you have 6/6 dragon with haste that people will not want to kill, especially if you can cast a Magda the next turn. The first two chapters on the saga are nice too, but man…14 treasures.

[[Gimli of the Glittering Caves]] Okay this is a good Gimli, great for Magda or heck any of the dwarf decks. In Commander you will always be casting legendary creatures and pumping him up will be easy. And double strike with treasure creation! Nice. Give him trample and it is a glorious dwarven day!

Green

[[Bag End Porter]] And here we have 2nd ever green dwarf. I like the art work, I like happy dwarves, not enough happy dwarf art work. Okay the only real use for this guy is in a Lady of Otaria deck, which wants green dwarves, and since he is one of 3, gets a pass. Also if you have the Lady out and let’s say Magda it’s a 6/6, not too bad.

[[Mirrormere Guardian]] Another green dwarf!!! And I am not sure, but I think this might be a female bearded dwarf. Definity can be thrown in the Lady of Otaria deck. Not sure how the Ring Tempted will be used in Dwarf decks, but there it is.

Multi-colored

[[Doors of Durin]] This is it, the premier dwarven tribal card of the set. And it is in red/green. Yes, it is the first real utility card for The Lady of Otaria. Getting to Scry 2 is great, as you can try and make sure you have dwarves on the top of your library. And if you do find dwarves on the scry, one of those dwarves end up on the battlefield immediately attacking. And trample is a very nice key word for this Dwarf deck!

[[Gimil, Mournful Avenger]] Another Gimli card! And it is interesting. It really seems like this card wanted to have white somewhere in its identity, but I guess they really wanted to push the Gruul Dwarves. Anyway Gimil also looks like it would work well in the Lady of Otaria deck and also with the Doors of Durin. If you attack with some dwarves with the Door of Durin out and get another dwarf attacking, and they die in the attack by a block, and if they die, this starts to trigger Gimil’s abilities. I think it could be a fun inclusion, although I was really hoping for a Boros Gimili or at least a Naya Gimli or Dwarf.

Colorless

[[Andúril, Flame of the West]] This is a solid equipment for a Boros Dwarf deck. Getting some more creatures or potentially attacking flying creatures is really neat! Also it could work well with Gimli, Mournful Avenger as it provides some nice 1/1 tokens to be reckless with and potentially activate his abilities.

[[Mithril Coat]] Okay this has to be my favorite equipment for this set, and for the last few sets! The Boros dwarves or even any dwarf deck will love this. Flash, Indestructible and attach to any legendary creature as it enters battlefield. This is fantastic! So many fun things you can do with this, not the least of which is combat tricks of course. And dwarves tend to die a lot, anything that prevents that is great!

[[Sting, the Glinting Dagger]] Another great equipment for dwarves, haste is always welcome, but the best part is the untapping the equipped creature. Untapping and tapping dwarves can lead to a lot of fun in a Magda deck who loves tapping dwarves!

Land

[[Mines of Moria]] This land is just great, my second favorite land right next to [[Dwarven Mine]]. I mean if you play this in a Magda commander deck it will almost always come in untapped. And then when your dwarves die you can turn them into treasure, again Magda likes!

Okay that’s what we have! Crossing fingers for some secret lair cards for Thorin Oakenshield and maybe some other dwarves!

Great news everyone -- the Lemmy CardFetcherBot is now live across all MTGZone communities. We're still updating it and working on getting running with supervisor on the server, but in the meantime it should be handling all comments and posts on our instance here.

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[[Venture Forth]]

Newbie question, but suppose more than one player has a copy of [[Long List of the Ents]] on the battlefield. Can you note a creature type that has already been noted by an opponent?

I'm personally excited to use LTR/LTC commander decks to get people into the game!

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